Ed Coper

Exactly.

And you look, when this takes over the news ecosystem, you look at the US, this is now dominating the political health apparatus as well.

RFK Jr.

is the health secretary there, the most senior health official in the government, has been plucked straight from all of these Instagram and TikTok style health conspiracies.

The Surgeon General is someone who adheres to all of these anti-vaccination conspiracies and the idea that we should make America healthy again by throwing out conventional medicine.

And this is increasingly what our view of the world becomes when your news source is social media.

So we need desperately to find a way to take traditional media standards and ethics and move them over to social media because people are not going to move back.

We have to find a way to get information through in a way that upholds all of the really crucial standards that you yourself as a journalist and everyone else here at the ABC adhere to.

That's the challenge or else we're going to go further and further down this very dark rabbit hole.

Do you have a theory on that, Ed?

It's absolutely crucial that we get to the bottom of this reason because we need to protect the things in Australia that prevent us going as far down the road as

as America has become.

They are incredibly polarised compared to Australia and Canada and other countries, similar Western democracies.

And there is more violence in politics there.

What are the things about Australia that prevent us from heading down that road?

There are a few that are important to cherish.

The first is in our political ecosystem.

Compulsory voting and preferential voting are cherished institutions that we must protect at all costs.

In America, to be successful in politics, you have to be more extreme than your competitor.

You have to appeal to the most engaged and enthusiastic supporters of your base.