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Australian True Crime

Shortcut: Living Among the Mafia - ATC International

03 Jun 2026

Transcription

Transcript generated automatically by AI and may contain errors.

Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?

0.031 - 17.094 Meshel Laurie

This is Australian True Crime International with Michelle Laurie. In 2006, Dutchwoman Sana Deboer had a small financial windfall and became one of those people we read about who bought an incredibly cheap run-down house in a picturesque village in Italy's Calabria region.

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17.695 - 26.207 Meshel Laurie

She was aware of the region's reputation as a mafia stronghold, but found it hard to believe her sweet neighbours could be involved in anything like that.

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Chapter 2: What motivated Sanne de Boer to buy a house in Calabria?

26.187 - 48.277 Meshel Laurie

Eventually, though, Sana began to realise that the very fabric of everyday life in her village was controlled by a strict code, enforced by the Drangada, one of the most powerful crime organisations in the world. Sana has written a book about her observations and experiences. It's called The New Mafia, and she joins us to talk about it. This is Australian True Crime.

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48.718 - 61.813 Meshel Laurie

We acknowledge the traditional owners of the land on which this podcast is created, the Wurundjeri Woi Wurrung people of the Kulin Nation. And a warning, this episode of the podcast contains graphic descriptions of violence.

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66.586 - 95.665 Sanne de Boer

I was invited by an author to help them write their book. So I was working there actually as an editor. I had never been in the south of Italy. I was immediately, I fell in love with the natural beauty of the place. I was living on this beautiful hilltop village by the sea. The people in the village was super welcoming to me. And of course, it took a while also for me to kind of...

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95.645 - 105.333 Sanne de Boer

To understand a little bit more about the local mafia clans, because it's understandable that people wouldn't be very ready to speak about it with me.

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Chapter 3: How did Sanne's perception of her neighbors change over time?

105.875 - 109.947 Sanne de Boer

Also, another factor was my Italian was still very basic.

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111.575 - 124.093 Sanne de Boer

It took me quite some years to be able to read the papers and to be able to eventually start reporting on the subject and to go and speak to all kinds of people about it.

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124.554 - 147.647 Meshel Laurie

I've been telling people about the book and the story I always relay to them is one night you heard a car explosion and everyone went out on the street and you realized that it belonged to a lady who worked at the council who gave out building permits to And eventually you realize she mustn't have given a permit to someone who wanted one. But significantly, the police never came.

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147.707 - 149.25 Meshel Laurie

The fire brigade never came.

149.29 - 173.814 Sanne de Boer

She never even called them. Right. It was in the middle of the night. It was such a shocking event. Everybody came out of their houses. Everybody was also very supportive of that family that was obviously heartbroken and shocked and very much afraid of what this was. But it was very significant that I realized nobody was calling the police. Nobody. She'd never she never filed a police report.

174.395 - 182.217 Sanne de Boer

Everybody helps to put out the fire. And eventually she she she quit her job and she moved away, sadly enough, as well. So so.

182.197 - 192.737 Meshel Laurie

So it's a very telling moment that everybody else understands what's happening. The Drangida also has quite a presence here in Australia and has done for a very long time.

Chapter 4: What experiences led Sanne to write her book 'The New Mafia'?

192.757 - 202.956 Meshel Laurie

And as does in Holland, it does all over Europe, America. And I think responsible for most of the cocaine movement around the world. Is that fair? Yeah.

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202.936 - 218.346 Sanne de Boer

That is what Italian law enforcement has said for many years, early 2000s up until maybe 10 years ago. They were definitely a very large factor in the cocaine smuggling all over the world.

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218.326 - 220.929 Meshel Laurie

And ecstasy was our, I'm sure you've read about it.

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220.949 - 221.79 Sanne de Boer

An ecstasy, yeah.

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221.81 - 227.597 Meshel Laurie

At the time was the biggest ecstasy hall in the world that happened here in Melbourne a couple of, probably 20 years ago now.

227.617 - 244.536 Sanne de Boer

And that's probably an Australian-Dutch connection as well there because it's in Holland, it's in Southern Holland and Belgium that most of the world's ecstasy is produced. So it was very probably produced in the Netherlands, then brought to Italy and transported to Australia. Yeah.

244.516 - 254.53 Meshel Laurie

And put in cans. Remember, put in cans that look like crushed tomatoes. Tomato cans, yes. Amazing, yeah. 15 million ecstasy pills. An amazing story.

Chapter 5: How does the 'Ndrangheta influence daily life in Calabria?

254.911 - 258.195 Meshel Laurie

So is that their main industry still, drugs, narcotics?

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258.355 - 282.048 Sanne de Boer

Yes, I believe it's their largest part of their income. They do, of course, also make a lot of money from just public contracts and drugs. Some extortion, not always extortion as in asking for protection money directly, but often also forcing people to buy products that are really highly priced.

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282.248 - 298.598 Meshel Laurie

Because we know that's the formula, right? That's the mafia formula is to open legitimate businesses for many reasons to gain control of other sectors of the economy, legitimate sectors. So all those things go on in all of the countries that they're That they're in?

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298.879 - 313.507 Sanne de Boer

Yeah. Yeah, definitely. In our country, there's a lot of investments in the hospitality sector, but it could be anything. And I believe also in Australia, there's, of course, the construction sector, the agriculture, many, many areas.

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313.607 - 330.878 Meshel Laurie

Are there other criminal groups encroaching on this issue? On these industries, in Australia at the moment, we have Middle Eastern gangs, I think, are really running the joint these days. And so I wonder if they, do you think they, do they work together? Do they end up fighting over things?

331.599 - 357.156 Sanne de Boer

What we've seen in investigations usually is that Ndrangheta clans collaborate with other more violent criminal groups in all these territories. So that what they actually do is that they come away with, they get away with it, basically, because the more violent criminal groups get targeted by law enforcement. And that's what was brought to light by Operation Ironside in Australia.

357.496 - 367.268 Sanne de Boer

And it was in 2022 that the motorcycle, the outlaw motorcycle gangs were actually collaborating with the Drangheta in the drug smuggling case.

367.248 - 379.772 Meshel Laurie

You're reminding me of something someone told me recently was that the Drangata these days are almost workers' consultants, almost sort of at the very highest level of putting people together but not getting their hands dirty.

380.191 - 400.841 Sanne de Boer

Crime as a service, they call it, at least I believe. Yeah, yeah. And so when these criminal groups get a chance to sort of evolve, and this is what happens. Their exploitation is not just of regular citizens, but it's also of other crime groups. Yeah, it's very corporate almost, isn't it?

Chapter 6: What shocking events highlighted the mafia's control in Sanne's village?

626.285 - 652.037 Sanne de Boer

And this is also the reason why for a long time there were hardly any state witnesses who were former members and turned to speak to the police because there is an actual rule in the Dangda that tells people if they do such a thing, they will be killed by their nearest family members. Oh, that's right. By their father or their brother. It's such a suffocating cruelty.

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652.237 - 681.565 Sanne de Boer

These rules are so extremely cruel and extremely binding in that sense that it's quite understandable for somebody to be born in such a family. to almost feel that there's no way out. I hope that the message of the book, definitely not to stigmatize Calabrian people, definitely not to also believe that all we have to do is now put all these criminals behind bars, because that's already happening.

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681.545 - 704.548 Sanne de Boer

most part in Italy, and it's not resolving the problem. I mean, there's less people being killed in Italy. There's a lot of people in jail. But when they come out, they just go back again because that's what is expected of them. So really what we need to do is to, and I think I will focus more about that in my newer work, is trying to find a more of a holistic approach to resolving these issues.

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710.047 - 734.383 Meshel Laurie

If you need support after listening to this podcast, you can call Lifeline on 13 11 14 or contact 1-800-RESPECT on 1-800-737-732 or 1800respect.org.au. Indigenous Australians can contact 13 Yarn on 13 9276 or 13yarn.org.au.

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740.371 - 755.106 Unknown

The producers of this podcast recognise the traditional owners of the land on which it's recorded. They pay respect to the Aboriginal elders past, present and those emerging.

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