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Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

👤 Person
119 appearances

Podcast Appearances

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Many of you out here will have a dog at home that's potentially cut off and isolated from anyone right now.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We as people have managed to bridge this divide just with a quick swipe of our phone, able to contact a loved one with video call or a telephone call.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

My research asks, what if we do the same for animals?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

What if we allow animals to use the internet and connect online?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Now, you may be laughing and think this is a really strange idea, but many of us already use technology with our pets.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Many people here will have collars which have trackers on, able to detect where their dog or cat is at any point.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And we as researchers often use screen technologies and various different sorts of technologies to monitor and measure animals' cognition and behavior.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

When we start to think about it, we actually control a lot of our animals' lives.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We control what they eat, we control where they go, we control what activities they do, and we even control their friends and who they see.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

What if we could instead use technology to flip this script?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

What if we could use technologies to enable animals to have choice over their lives and control, including their social life?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So I began this journey when I was 21, and I got my dog, Zach, who you can see here.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

At the time, I was studying a master's in computer science.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I got really into building Arduino and Raspberry Pi and low-fidelity computer technology.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And I was sitting one day on the sofa with my dog, and I started to think, what if he could also control the TV with me when we were watching it together?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

What if, as well as me changing the channel, my dog could do the same?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And importantly, would this even be what a dog would want?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so I began to build my dog and many different other dogs' computer devices.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I began building these screen devices that detect when a dog gets close and then plays them different sorts of videos.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

After using this device with various different dogs, what I found is that all dogs introduced to this device would use this without any form of training.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

While why they use it, we really don't know why they would use this device.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We don't know if they understand the device, but to keep using it implies some level of enrichment, some level of understanding.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Later on, I then moved to Finland, in Helsinki, and I was visiting the zoo, and I started to realize that many other zoo animals also have little control over their lives.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so I expanded my work, and I started working with white-faced Saki monkeys.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

These are a tiny species of monkeys, typically live about mid-range in the rainforest and rather elusive.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I built them this tunnel device that, again, similar to the dog device, whenever they enter, would play them different audio and different sorts of videos.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I gave them these two devices over several different months, and what I found was fascinating.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We found that these monkeys significantly like watching underwater barracudas and jellyfish and mealworms, which makes more sense because they eat mealworms.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And what they like listening to is really heavy beeping traffic noise, which makes completely no sense.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And like I mentioned before, it's not only about what they use it for, but also the impact on them.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So we started to look at also the changes in their behaviors.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Does using this device change something about them?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And what we found was that they significantly reduced their scratching behavior, which can be seen as a stressful behavior.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so we start to get onto something more powerful here, that giving animals technology not only gives them a choice and ability to control their lives, but it also gives them something which can impact their well-being and improves their health.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Now, as I mentioned before, we don't really know why animals use technology.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Is it because it gives them a choice?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Is it because of the stimuli or videos or audio that it gives?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Is it something totally different?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We don't really know.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We can't ask them a questionnaire the same as we can do when we do research with humans.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

This marmoset monkey, for instance, researchers gave a light switch where they were able to turn on and off a light inside their own enclosure.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

From having this light switch, what researchers find is they would continually turn on and off this light.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And they suspect they do this not because they want the light, but because it gives them control over their environment.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

It gives them predictability.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so you can see it's really confusing and sometimes unknown and complex on why animals would use technology in the first place.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So I kept developing different devices for animals, from heating devices, audio devices, and different video devices.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

But I started to realize that we still control the most fundamental part of our animals' lives, which is the social lives.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Global lockdown taught us that we as humans, when we are isolated, it is bad for our mental health.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And the same could be said for many different sorts of animals.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Many animals live naturally in the wild in really big groups.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Parrots fly in flocks of hundreds, dogs run in packs.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Primates often live in really complex groups, such as chimpanzees, which come together and then go apart in a process called fission fusion.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And when we keep animals in captivity for practical reasons, we don't always keep them in the same groups.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

There's limited cost, there's limited space, and also sometimes behavioral management.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Recently, I visited an aquarium and the head of research there was showing me the fish that they keep to one side because they're naughty and fight with other fish.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so even these animals you can see sometimes are separated.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So I started to wonder, what if we could use technology to connect these animals together?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

What if we could use video calls to do this?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We as humans have used video calls, and this has benefited us a lot.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Would animals want this, and would they use this?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So I started with what I knew, which was my dog.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I built him this ball device which recognized when he carries it and when he moves it around and his leaning behaviors, and it would video call me from a TV that I set up in our lounge.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I gave him this device whenever he was home alone, and I waited to see if he would ring me.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

What I found is that he would ring me a lot.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

He started video calling me and developing these routines.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Typically he would ring me often in the morning and then later on in the evening.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

But sometimes these calls became a bit too much.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Sometimes he would ring me back to back to back, and I would talk to him about our daily life, but eventually I'd just run out of things to talk about.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so what I did was I flipped the camera in my phone around, and instead I started showing him my world.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I showed him the people I was with, I showed him the food I was eating, buskers in the street, wherever I was is what I showed him.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And in many ways, the technology then became a tool for him to have a portal beyond his home.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

But there was still a problem here that me as a person wasn't always available, which is why I was often out of the house.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I was in meetings.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I couldn't keep running this study of picking up these phone calls.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So I started to wonder, what if animals could ring each other instead?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And we just cut people out.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And this brought me to parrots.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Parrots are really highly social creatures, often live in big groups, really complex, and have really deep and meaningful relationships with each other.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And yet when we keep them as pets, we often keep them alone.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So I started to wonder, would a parrot video call another parrot if given a choice?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So I got my thinking head on, and me and my collaborators, we started to build a screen-based system on a tablet, which had profile photos of different parrots, and then taught parrots how to trigger the video calls by using their tongues on the screens.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So they ring a bell to get over the caregiver.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Hi.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We then gave parrots a system for a couple of months, and what we found was they used the system a lot, similar to my dog.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Because they had a choice of friends, we also couldn't look at who they called, and what we found is that they actually had favorite friends, in the same way that me and you have favorite friends we like to call.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We also found that they did more calls the more they were called in, so there's an element of sociality here then.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We then looked at what behaviors they did within the calls, and they did such vast and wonderful different behaviors.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

For instance, they groomed together, they also played together, they showed each other their toys, they danced together, and they even sing together.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

But still we face the problem that sometimes parrots want to trigger a call and the person had to set up the system or the other parrot wasn't available in the same way we were in France and they're not always available.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so I started to wonder, could we change the system?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

In essence, does it matter if the other parrot is live in real time?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Can we just play videos instead?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so I modified the system.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I rebuilt it and put in these video versions of parrots.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So these were videos of parrots in video calls rather than live calls.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I then introduced the parrots to these new video versions and gave them back the system to use.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I was asking here, can a parrot tell the difference between a live and a prerecorded version of the system?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And what I found was when we gave parrots the system, there was an immediate behavior change.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Parrots reduced the amount of times they triggered calls within the system and also reduced the amount of time they spent in the calls.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And this wasn't a gradual, this was instantaneous as soon as we took away the live interaction.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Now, while we don't know what a parrot understands about being online, we're still very much looking at this with people, what this starts to imply is that parrots somehow are able to tell and potentially make some understanding of being in the digital world.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Now, parrots don't live alone.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

They also live with their caregivers.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

And so we also ask their caregivers, how did they find this system?

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Because part of making technology for animals is also making sure that it works for those around them.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

When we surveyed all caregivers, what we found is that 100% of caregivers said that their bird benefited from this system.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

They said that they felt closer to the bird, that it helped their relationship with their bird, and they had more trust in there.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

However, beyond these different animals using the system, and there's much more out there, the findings really go beyond this.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We are starting to begin to uncover, really, that animals have social awareness and understanding of potentially being online and each other.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

By using the systems with animals, we're starting to discover that animals have really complex and deep needs.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

They have lots of different emotions and maybe they prefer heavy traffic noise rather than Taylor Swift like us, but we're starting to uncover more about them as we go.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

I also see a really bright future for this sort of technology.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Imagine if you put your dog into the vet and you're still able to connect with them to video call and they're still able to connect with their friends.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

We keep many animals in zoos that for, as I mentioned, whatever reason are separated.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Maybe we could use technologies to connect animals together and keep in touch with family groups.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Now, I'm biased because I build this technology, but I really see the enormous potential that this technology can bring.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

It's got so many exciting possibilities, and 100% of animals we've given this technology to so far use it, and it benefits the relationship with their caregivers.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

So the next time you make a video call to a loved one, just remember that a parent might be doing the same, reaching out across the divide, seeking connection and companionship in their own unique way.

TED Talks Daily
What happens when your dog uses the internet | Ilyena Hirskyj-Douglas

Thank you very much.