Michael Angarano

It was one of those where, like... Yeah, yeah. I mean, offer only. Offer only. But it was also, like, a wonderful surprise. Like, it wasn't like things were just rolling in. Okay. And I also had just come off a show that was... didn't get picked up for a third season. No, it was this other show called I'm Dying Up Here.

And so it was this weird in-between land where you're like, I'm not sure if this show's going to go anymore. And so my agent called me and he was like, I've never been this excited about something for you. And he was like, there's this arc on This Is Us that that I was in Atlantic City at my mother's dancing school's dance competition. Okay. Where, like...

I found out about this, and I talked to Isaac Aptaker on the phone at this dance competition, and he pitched me this arc, and I was like, sounds crazy. You're going to go to Vietnam on this show. Right. I mean, you're going to be on This Is Us, but in Vietnam. In Vietnam, yeah. And it wasn't totally clear exactly. He didn't tell me everything, but he told me, He told me a lot.

He basically told me the first four or so episodes that I was on. Yeah. Gotcha.

That's a great question. I think like eight or something. Yeah. Eight or nine. Over the course of the show. Or something like that. And so, but no, I hadn't spoken to Milo just via text a little bit. Yeah. Okay. And then it wasn't until I showed up.

There was like this very, you know, a very brief but intensive little boot camp that they did with the soldiers, the actors who played the soldiers in the show. And as one would expect, this took place in Lake Piru. And as one would expect, Milo was like... Leading the charge. Leading the charge. And actually... I was late. I was late the first day because they weren't bringing me to it.

And so it was like the morning of and I was like, I found out. I was like, I think I should go to this. They were excluding me from it. And I kind of weaseled my way in. So I showed up late. And I forget his name, but the consultant who was running that boot camp. Didn't know that you...

weren't supposed to but yeah yeah but he was also like hey you're late like sure kind of giving me shit like don't like we don't get late here and milo was like hey no no you're not gonna give him shit right now he fully that's right jack pearson yeah yeah yeah and i was like yeah man

Thanks, man.

Please. It's two old friends, myself, Michael, Sarah, who go on an impromptu road trip from Los Angeles to Sacramento. That's it. That is literally... That's all you need to know. That's all you need to know. And it started as exactly that. We started writing it 10 years ago. And it's just funny because we're shooting this, doing this in Los Feliz adjacent area, east side.

That ain't no wig, my man. Oh, excuse me. I'm sorry. That's all me. It became a wig later in the show. Got it, got it, got it.

Shoulder length.

You know, this was the old stomping grounds 10 years ago. And I don't live around here anymore, but driving around here, I'm like, oh, yeah, we used to write in this coffee shop. We used to hang out at the Par 3 down the street. This is like where my friend Chris Smith and I, we wrote this 10 years ago and didn't start. When we wrote it, we didn't really know what it was going to become.

Or do they, I'm not sure. I'm not sure we really discussed a lot about, about, um, the history of the family, their, their mother. I don't, I don't remember any specific conversations with, with Isaac or, Elizabeth or Dan, or Ken even, I feel like that was... That was one of the things that when I read the script, it was just a detail.

And obviously, I had caught up in the show a little bit, so I knew about it. But that was something I... The script informed me of, so to speak. Yeah. But we didn't really discuss it.

But one thing I'll say is that when we... Milo and I all the time, especially outside of the Vietnam stuff, like all the stuff within that Pearson home, that Pearson home, all those scenes, there was something that felt very... very lived in already. Like it felt like it was all laid out for us.

And we were just like, you know, when you're, when you're acting in something and you're like, oh, I'm kind of just like living this other parallel life. It felt like that. It felt, and we would look at each other sometimes and unspoken, unspoken looks to each other where we would be like,

this works yeah that's there yeah that's like that feels right yeah no nothing felt nothing ever really felt like out of out of i guess rhythm is the wrong word but it felt like nothing ever felt out of rhythm in that sense the scene of you two getting ready to go watch the draft at a bar yeah was was one of those scenes where i was just like this just feels

We wanted to make it eventually, but it started just as this impromptu road trip from Los Angeles to Sacramento. It started as like a joke. Hey, you want like a million signs around Los Angeles? Say I-5 North Sacramento. Yeah. So we just reverse engineered the story around that joke one day. We did a pilot together that didn't get picked up.

He feels doomed. He feels doomed. And the original title of this script, which I loved, was called Born Lucky. Right.

Yeah. I don't know. I think that was the real footage. That's what I was going to say.

I think it was. I think they used the real footage.

So we were unemployed, hanging out, going to like the par three in the batting cages. And we, yeah, man, we just, you know, as we grew and evolved and matured as guys, like the story changed and evolved and kind of became what it is now. Which I don't want to spoil the movie. We're not going to spoil it. Yeah, don't spoil it. But that's sort of what, that's kind of how it grew.

Did you? Yeah.

It's mind-blowing.

That draft scene, that draft lottery scene, I think was the one day that I was around that Tim O'Brien was on set. Oh, wow. read his book, and it just was... He never stopped being so helpful and effusive about the whole show and how it's being treated and everything, but him being there that day gave it another air of something in the atmosphere that felt, you know, that was... Like weighted?

Yeah, very weighted. Yeah. Yeah, that scene was, I think in the entire, my experience of the show was my favorite scene. Yeah, it was a great scene. Just because, just exactly for what you guys are saying, it's like what a moment in history for these people. Young men. And like, I remember at the time, my brother was 19. And, you know, these people were 19, 18, 19. That is nothing. Nothing.

That is nothing. You know, and that is just still hard to comprehend. Yeah. How, you know, what's at stake really and what's being decided for them. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, so many. Yeah. So many. And I'm so happy that it's gotten a theatrical release and a pretty significant one. I mean, it's all over the country. It was only in a couple 200 theaters, but still it's like people all across the country and in Canada can go see it. So it was...

Yeah.

Yeah. One of the ways that him and Jack are so different, because I feel like if Jack were drafted, he wouldn't have that mindset. He doesn't think of it as a death sentence. Nicky, for whatever reason, is cut from a different cloth, so to speak, and they're like, no, I'm not going to make it. He's either smart enough.

It's like my younger brother, when he went on one audition once and was thinking about being an actor when he was very young, and then he went on one audition, and he was like, no, I'm never doing that again. Why would I do that again? Nikki looks at that realistically and is like, I'm not coming out of that. I'm not.

And maybe it's Jack's own ignorance, confidence, how he's built versus how Nikki's built. But he's like, no, that's not happening. That's not my fate. If I go, I'm not coming back.

It wasn't until I think I watched our notes screening, and we had a big notes screening when we were editing, where I realized how much a movie like this needs to be seen in a theater. Because it is a comedy. And it's not the same when you watch it alone in a room. Sure. And even it affected our editing process. It's like, oh, this actually plays, and it plays bigger.

Nice. He says CK. He says CK, referencing Clark Kent.

They would have a white van still. Let me ask, as long as we're being honest, have you carried on the tighty? Whitey?

And so to answer the question, I think when we were making it, I mean, even though I would have always loved it to be in a theater, I don't think I ever was dead set on it being released in theaters. Because I was just like, oh, I just want people to see it. However people can see it, whether it's on a stream, whatever it is these days, I was like, that's going to be what it is.

That was a quick tangent. Because when I... I mean, just to work out with a trainer, we aim for like 400, 500. Yeah. But even that's... Really? That's pushing it. It feels like a lot. Here's the thing. Well, I am curious. This is a full-on tangent. Go ahead. Do it. Do it. Because, okay, so I...

When Maya was doing Mr. and Mrs. Smith, she was training for the show, and she started training with this trainer, and I started training with them too. And they were great. They would really work you. And I've gone to the gym. I've worked out. I've played sports my whole life.

However, when I would work out with these people, I would always be like, I'm either going to shit my pants, throw up, or pass out. Sure. And I don't want to feel that every day. No, you don't. And so it is the feeling of being like, I finding that like I want to be pushed. Yes. I don't want to like kill myself.

And so the fact that we got... an actual significant release in theaters, I've just been so happy because it's so, it's so harmonious with the film itself. Like it really should be seen in the theater and it's really nice to see it with people. Yeah. To experience it together. It should be just, you know, you forget. Yeah.

Sully, you know about long gait. I do, in fact.

It is. We are at the zone two cardio equivalent of talking about this.

It needs to ruin your day. It needs to like, I'm not eating lunch.

Thank you, Susie, for sharing that. Michael, any thoughts? It's so powerful. I'm just thinking in my head the amount of times that what goes into making anything. So many decisions. It feels very technical. Sometimes you feel emotionally detached from it. And then the making of something is always different. But once something is out there, it becomes subjective.

You never know how somebody is watching something, what's going on with them that day, what's happened in their lives. But something that you do... Especially when it's on television, especially when millions of people are watching it. What I feel like this show did and does so well is it opens a vault. Yeah. And that vault, it allows people to...

access and think about things that, you know, are really personal and it allows them to, you know, be affected by something. And it's just, it's amazing how, you know, the vault that the show unlocked in that and how, you know, intimately it affected so many people. Yeah.

And just to give him a, you know, nice shout out and credit. Like when I, cause again, I, well, I kind of caught up with the show once I got it, but I remember watching the scene with you and Milo. And I remember thinking how great you guys are. And I, And there was just this moment that he had where when he's telling you he's drunk and he says, I'm drunk right now.

And I'm like, wow, that is such... What made it so powerful to me is that he didn't seem it. And that's... True. Anybody who knows people who are functioning, alcoholics or drug addicts or anything, it's like, yeah, he's not playing. It was just so tastefully and well done, I thought, in that moment.

I just love, just to go back to this letter, just that specific moment of somebody you know who is...

Well, the trick is you don't.

that's part of it well but the really amazing I've always kind of said that this film just because it was always written with the idea of it being fun for us like it was never really wrote it to make money we're not making money but it was always with the idea of like you know if this ever stops being fun we're gonna stop and for Chris and I so it always was born around this like good energy concept

And then, when we were trying to package the movie, Mike Serra, we get, who I've been a friend of for, you know, 20 years at this point. And so, Maya came around. Yeah. We were not together. Okay. I did not know Maya personally at all. How's that? I was just a fan of her show, Pen15. Yeah? Mm-hmm.

And so I wrote her a letter asking her to, you know, if she was interested, if she would want to attach herself to the part. This is how you guys met? This is how we met.

Yeah, this is how we met. And this film, we met. She said yes, which was, for us, that was like a miracle. Because for this character, she's like... It's such an important, integral character to the story. And I've always said it. And this is what I said in my letter to her.

I was like, really, the film, the film's tone, the film's, I mean, everything about the film really hinges on this performance and this character. And so it's a small Venn diagram of what we need from this actor to play this part. Yeah. And so the fact that she said yes was like such a win for us. And we wouldn't meet Maya and I for like months because she was doing season two of her show.

And so it was like a very, very small window. Her agent called mine like the day before. She's like, Maya will be available at 4 p.m. tomorrow. Yeah. And I'm like, I'm there.

Yes. No, literally. I was like, wherever, however, I'll like, I'll bring her lunch, whatever it is. I'll like, just want to say hi and duck out. I'll give her babies. Yes. Literally, I will start a life. And so the meeting went very well. Very well. Went very well. And we... truthfully, like we spoke about the movie for like seven minutes and we met for like, you know, two hours.

It was just like, and we just very much got along. But we, you know, we, we wouldn't, the movie wouldn't get made for several years. And so, you know, we just kept in touch and, you know, months later we started dating and then, and then, you know, the movie would get made. By the time the movie got made, we were engaged and had a child. Oh, Listen, you own a wife. Write a movie.

And when you see the film, it has this amazing sort of prophetic-ness to it. Oh, I can't wait.

That's true. Walter Matthau.

It's already picked up.

Mm-hmm.

When you guys shot. Yeah. Had you worked with Milo before? Yes. We did a film together. A Jason Statham film called Wild Card. Of course you did. Yeah.

Yeah, we shot it in New Orleans. We didn't overlap a lot, but when we did, it was always a very grounding presence. With Statham or with Milo?

Yeah.

You're absolutely right.

But he wanted to be that for his kids so desperately. And he was. I think they both were. Absolutely.

Yes.

Gerald McCraney.

Nowhere to be found.

You start to feel the real desperation.

waiting for Deja to reemerge.

Yes.

Yeah.

What a great reminder for all of us, for us, for the listeners.