Ryan Lee

I worked just enough, just barely until graduate school when I actually figured out what I wanted to do. And then there's passion. Yeah. Diligence became an application of, of, the choices that I was able to make. Right. If somebody else made the choices for me, I didn't care. But if I got to make the choice, I could work hard at it.

I worked just enough, just barely until graduate school when I actually figured out what I wanted to do. And then there's passion. Yeah. Diligence became an application of, of, the choices that I was able to make. Right. If somebody else made the choices for me, I didn't care. But if I got to make the choice, I could work hard at it.

Well, I did a little bit of look on into this idea behind one of the other evolutions of diligence. And that is that in some cultures, it's seen as insufficient and some as excessive, right? Where you have this, the TSMC leadership saying there is insufficient diligence used. I'm using that as a code for work ethic. Yeah. We might look at that and say, you know, it's excessive.

Well, I did a little bit of look on into this idea behind one of the other evolutions of diligence. And that is that in some cultures, it's seen as insufficient and some as excessive, right? Where you have this, the TSMC leadership saying there is insufficient diligence used. I'm using that as a code for work ethic. Yeah. We might look at that and say, you know, it's excessive.

What you're asking is excessive and there's no work life balance. So how do you balance inefficient versus excessive diligence? And the first thing I thought about was like Southern Europe, because one of the bits of reputation in Southern Europe is that those people know how to rest. That has been the thing that I've carried in my head, right?

What you're asking is excessive and there's no work life balance. So how do you balance inefficient versus excessive diligence? And the first thing I thought about was like Southern Europe, because one of the bits of reputation in Southern Europe is that those people know how to rest. That has been the thing that I've carried in my head, right?

And Mexico, for example, you go and you know what a siesta is. Like I've known that a siesta exists since I was in grade school. So in the U.S., right, long working hours and constant productivity are seen as signs of diligence and commitment. Compare that to Southern Europe, like Spain or Italy, the American work ethic is lampooned as excessive, right?

And Mexico, for example, you go and you know what a siesta is. Like I've known that a siesta exists since I was in grade school. So in the U.S., right, long working hours and constant productivity are seen as signs of diligence and commitment. Compare that to Southern Europe, like Spain or Italy, the American work ethic is lampooned as excessive, right?

The whole concept of work-life balance is more pronounced in those cultures where the lunch breaks and siestas are common. In Japan, what would you guess the Japanese model for work ethic is?

The whole concept of work-life balance is more pronounced in those cultures where the lunch breaks and siestas are common. In Japan, what would you guess the Japanese model for work ethic is?

Right. And in fact, the word karoshi is, I mean, you laugh because you'd be crying. It's death from overwork. That is a concept that exists in Japan. It just highlights the extent to which diligence is pushed. And you compare that to many Western countries, that's insane levels of intensity. Why would we be that unhealthy and eventually counterproductive?

Right. And in fact, the word karoshi is, I mean, you laugh because you'd be crying. It's death from overwork. That is a concept that exists in Japan. It just highlights the extent to which diligence is pushed. And you compare that to many Western countries, that's insane levels of intensity. Why would we be that unhealthy and eventually counterproductive?

In Korea, Samsung, the company Samsung, decided, you know, we're having some trouble meeting our goals. So we're going to go ahead and go to six day work weeks for everybody. Right. Like that, according to the most rational sort of human science, human resources science or sociological research, that's counterproductive. People need more rest and rehabilitation, recuperation time to be right.

In Korea, Samsung, the company Samsung, decided, you know, we're having some trouble meeting our goals. So we're going to go ahead and go to six day work weeks for everybody. Right. Like that, according to the most rational sort of human science, human resources science or sociological research, that's counterproductive. People need more rest and rehabilitation, recuperation time to be right.

Germany, what would you say? How would you say you contrast comparing as Germany, German work ethic?

Germany, what would you say? How would you say you contrast comparing as Germany, German work ethic?

That I get out of this. But what I was able to find out was sort of a balance between those things, that the work culture is known for efficiency and punctuality, really celebrating completing work tasks within working hours. So I wonder if there's a measure of productivity per hour if Germany is high on that mark, right?

That I get out of this. But what I was able to find out was sort of a balance between those things, that the work culture is known for efficiency and punctuality, really celebrating completing work tasks within working hours. So I wonder if there's a measure of productivity per hour if Germany is high on that mark, right?

Yes.

Yes.

Yeah. So during your workday, you work hard, but at the end of the workday, you're finished and you are able to turn off work better than many other cultures. I think that's interesting. Compare it with something like Brazil, which is, you know, much more relaxed approach to time and deadlines.

Yeah. So during your workday, you work hard, but at the end of the workday, you're finished and you are able to turn off work better than many other cultures. I think that's interesting. Compare it with something like Brazil, which is, you know, much more relaxed approach to time and deadlines.

And what is largely, especially you compare it to someplace like Germany, it's vastly insufficient and not diligent compared to Germany. So I think that's just really interesting stuff. And here we have this concept of diligence that is supposed to be you know, enshrined in our moral and ethical fabric across humanity. And it is wildly disputed in practice in cultures around the world.

And what is largely, especially you compare it to someplace like Germany, it's vastly insufficient and not diligent compared to Germany. So I think that's just really interesting stuff. And here we have this concept of diligence that is supposed to be you know, enshrined in our moral and ethical fabric across humanity. And it is wildly disputed in practice in cultures around the world.

It is so, so different. Like, I don't. How do you live up to it? How do you live up to this concept of diligence? When you think about where we could be in the world, that, that is the open question that I am left with thinking about this particular heavenly virtue.

It is so, so different. Like, I don't. How do you live up to it? How do you live up to this concept of diligence? When you think about where we could be in the world, that, that is the open question that I am left with thinking about this particular heavenly virtue.

Yeah. Yeah. Just talking about it, you're tied in knots. Yeah. Right? Like it is one of the more interesting concepts we've come to because it's not just do I get up in the morning and work hard to finish things? Right. I try. Every day I get up and I try to create something new. And, you know, for a long time, we talked about like the thing that,

Yeah. Yeah. Just talking about it, you're tied in knots. Yeah. Right? Like it is one of the more interesting concepts we've come to because it's not just do I get up in the morning and work hard to finish things? Right. I try. Every day I get up and I try to create something new. And, you know, for a long time, we talked about like the thing that,

that I like to check off at the end of the day is, did I ship something new? Did I finish something and put it out in the world? And for me, it's pretty easy because I measure it in episodes or web content or something published. And so I try to publish something new every day in some capacity for someone. But I also feel like the practice...

that I like to check off at the end of the day is, did I ship something new? Did I finish something and put it out in the world? And for me, it's pretty easy because I measure it in episodes or web content or something published. And so I try to publish something new every day in some capacity for someone. But I also feel like the practice...

is trying to let go of the fear that drives me to unhealthy levels of diligence. I see.

is trying to let go of the fear that drives me to unhealthy levels of diligence. I see.

Yeah. Right. That's the huge, huge question that if I don't provide something, if I don't end up doing this thing, that anxiety of like, I won't get that next job, I won't get that next client is is still very real. And on. You know, as we record this in two weeks, I'll have been doing this 18 years and I still carry that incredible anxiety every day. Yeah.

Yeah. Right. That's the huge, huge question that if I don't provide something, if I don't end up doing this thing, that anxiety of like, I won't get that next job, I won't get that next client is is still very real. And on. You know, as we record this in two weeks, I'll have been doing this 18 years and I still carry that incredible anxiety every day. Yeah.

Is that crazy?

Is that crazy?

And now, an excerpt from Be Diligent by Adebayo Tajuddin.

And now, an excerpt from Be Diligent by Adebayo Tajuddin.

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The robot hasn't messed up its job once. Oh, okay. So, diligence. Yeah. I did the usual thing, and I started looking up the, you know, it's a sins and virtues show, right? We have to talk about diligence. So you went back to the scrolls. As a part, I did. I have my scrolls in my personal Roman library. Yep. And as a part of the, you know, the combination of the cardinal virtues,

The robot hasn't messed up its job once. Oh, okay. So, diligence. Yeah. I did the usual thing, and I started looking up the, you know, it's a sins and virtues show, right? We have to talk about diligence. So you went back to the scrolls. As a part, I did. I have my scrolls in my personal Roman library. Yep. And as a part of the, you know, the combination of the cardinal virtues,

And like all the empty space is filled in with spirals. Like, is that kind of how bad did it get? Yeah. There is just about not, like, I'm just thinking about it because I think, oh, it's fun to do any job on the film set. I love film sets. And then you described one that would be the worst, like the most horrible. And I'll say maybe this is the spiritual cousin of diligence, but attention.

And like all the empty space is filled in with spirals. Like, is that kind of how bad did it get? Yeah. There is just about not, like, I'm just thinking about it because I think, oh, it's fun to do any job on the film set. I love film sets. And then you described one that would be the worst, like the most horrible. And I'll say maybe this is the spiritual cousin of diligence, but attention.

is not a thing that I tend to have a lot of in these kinds of scenarios because my attention is so fractured. I should say that differently. Attention is something I have a lot of because it's so fractured. Like my attention is in a million different places, in dizzyingly busy scenes for detail, and I miss, as a result, actually a lot.

is not a thing that I tend to have a lot of in these kinds of scenarios because my attention is so fractured. I should say that differently. Attention is something I have a lot of because it's so fractured. Like my attention is in a million different places, in dizzyingly busy scenes for detail, and I miss, as a result, actually a lot.

And I think you have painted a picture of a job that is terrifying to me.

And I think you have painted a picture of a job that is terrifying to me.

Yes.

Yes.

We've had incredible guests like actress Dee Wallace, cinematographer Eric Messerschmidt, director Steve Miner, and former Disney animators Tom and Tony Bancroft. They share their favorite films and the impact they've had on their careers, offering fascinating insights into the craftsmanship and storytelling techniques that make these movies so special.

We've had incredible guests like actress Dee Wallace, cinematographer Eric Messerschmidt, director Steve Miner, and former Disney animators Tom and Tony Bancroft. They share their favorite films and the impact they've had on their careers, offering fascinating insights into the craftsmanship and storytelling techniques that make these movies so special.

You called me, we texted a little bit yesterday, and you were exhausted. And you still managed to come through with something I needed from you late last night. But my question is, and I think this is part of the discussion of diligence, which is stamina. You put in these incredibly long days, and I'm curious your take on what happens to you. It was 12 and a half hours. Okay, 12 and a half hours.

You called me, we texted a little bit yesterday, and you were exhausted. And you still managed to come through with something I needed from you late last night. But my question is, and I think this is part of the discussion of diligence, which is stamina. You put in these incredibly long days, and I'm curious your take on what happens to you. It was 12 and a half hours. Okay, 12 and a half hours.

And so you put in on these days, what happens to your... to your desire to see it through by hour eight, like how do you muster whatever it takes to be, to be present until the very end? Is it just, you're excited about the job? You like it so much. You got to be there. You made the choice. What is it?

And so you put in on these days, what happens to your... to your desire to see it through by hour eight, like how do you muster whatever it takes to be, to be present until the very end? Is it just, you're excited about the job? You like it so much. You got to be there. You made the choice. What is it?

And the cardinal sins, that's what we're talking about this season, of course. Diligence, it has been valued throughout history and across cultures as this important character trait, right? And ethical principle that has sort of transcended the canonical virtue. And it is one of the seven heavenly virtues. It stands in opposition to the deadly sin of sin. Do you know which one? Sloth.

And the cardinal sins, that's what we're talking about this season, of course. Diligence, it has been valued throughout history and across cultures as this important character trait, right? And ethical principle that has sort of transcended the canonical virtue. And it is one of the seven heavenly virtues. It stands in opposition to the deadly sin of sin. Do you know which one? Sloth.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How many days do you find you can do this kind of thing in a row? Do you have any sense of it? And I'm, and I'm, we're probably asking back to 30 nights because you, you had a number of long days right in a row.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How many days do you find you can do this kind of thing in a row? Do you have any sense of it? And I'm, and I'm, we're probably asking back to 30 nights because you, you had a number of long days right in a row.

Well, you know, that's an interesting – like you joke about it, but the idea of compensating for diligence is the thing that makes diligence so complicated to me. Like we, if diligence is such a cultural norm that we are, you know, that we're, that we work so hard to the point that we have to like compensate for our work habits with substance. Do you know what I mean?

Well, you know, that's an interesting – like you joke about it, but the idea of compensating for diligence is the thing that makes diligence so complicated to me. Like we, if diligence is such a cultural norm that we are, you know, that we're, that we work so hard to the point that we have to like compensate for our work habits with substance. Do you know what I mean?

Like that's the, the problem is that that diligence hyper diligence is workaholism. And that's the thing that makes diligence so confusing, right? It's a virtue and it's,

Like that's the, the problem is that that diligence hyper diligence is workaholism. And that's the thing that makes diligence so confusing, right? It's a virtue and it's,

we at some level we revile it and we talk about how we work life balance is so important and I think it's easier in situations like making a movie because making a movie starts and ends right there's an end to it and you can see it when you are working at making chips in a factory When does that end?

we at some level we revile it and we talk about how we work life balance is so important and I think it's easier in situations like making a movie because making a movie starts and ends right there's an end to it and you can see it when you are working at making chips in a factory When does that end?

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Coming up next week, Tom, do you even know? I have no idea. I'm not on. Oh, wait, I can find out. It's a secret. We don't have to record to record, if you know what I mean. Wink. It's a clips show.

Coming up next week, Tom, do you even know? I have no idea. I'm not on. Oh, wait, I can find out. It's a secret. We don't have to record to record, if you know what I mean. Wink. It's a clips show.

It's perfect. Us from before. Until then, I'm Pete Wright.

It's perfect. Us from before. Until then, I'm Pete Wright.

It is sloth. That is the truth. You have been listening. Yep. So that's Christianity. Bible's got diligence in it. The hand of diligence will rule while the slothful will be put to forced labor. That seems vindictive, Proverbs. Buddhism has it apparently, according to those who were there, the Buddha's last words were reportedly, strive on with diligence. So how's that for a guilt complex? Wow.

It is sloth. That is the truth. You have been listening. Yep. So that's Christianity. Bible's got diligence in it. The hand of diligence will rule while the slothful will be put to forced labor. That seems vindictive, Proverbs. Buddhism has it apparently, according to those who were there, the Buddha's last words were reportedly, strive on with diligence. So how's that for a guilt complex? Wow.

In Buddhism, diligence is one of the six perfections. Oh, okay. It is seen as crucial for spiritual progress, apparently. So, you know, right. Hinduism, diligence is associated with Dharma, righteous living, and is considered essential for success and, wait for it, ethical profit. Okay.

In Buddhism, diligence is one of the six perfections. Oh, okay. It is seen as crucial for spiritual progress, apparently. So, you know, right. Hinduism, diligence is associated with Dharma, righteous living, and is considered essential for success and, wait for it, ethical profit. Okay.

I see. Okay. I don't know. I don't know. In this case, we're talking about very, very old texts. And I think it is possible that profit could be seen as something different than monetary value. But I do find it funny.

I see. Okay. I don't know. I don't know. In this case, we're talking about very, very old texts. And I think it is possible that profit could be seen as something different than monetary value. But I do find it funny.

It's all back to capitalism. Yeah. And it sort of reminds me of like the Ferengi in Star Trek, which I know you're probably not, that might be lost on you.

It's all back to capitalism. Yeah. And it sort of reminds me of like the Ferengi in Star Trek, which I know you're probably not, that might be lost on you.

Those are the, those are the triples. The Ferengi have giant ears and their entire system of governance is based on profit. And they have like this, their, their gospels are like the, the 900 rules of profit and everybody has to memorize the rules of profit. And, I find it very, very funny. And that is what I, you know, diligence is associated with the Ferengi and their worlds of profit.

Those are the, those are the triples. The Ferengi have giant ears and their entire system of governance is based on profit. And they have like this, their, their gospels are like the, the 900 rules of profit and everybody has to memorize the rules of profit. And, I find it very, very funny. And that is what I, you know, diligence is associated with the Ferengi and their worlds of profit.

It's in the Quran. I mean, it's everywhere. Diligence is everywhere. Modern perspectives on diligence. I mean, I think we kind of know where this is. Education, it's seen as a key factor in academic success. You work hard, right? You're persistent. Research shows that diligent students tend to perform better academically. Research had to show that. Studying makes things easier? Great. Yeah.

It's in the Quran. I mean, it's everywhere. Diligence is everywhere. Modern perspectives on diligence. I mean, I think we kind of know where this is. Education, it's seen as a key factor in academic success. You work hard, right? You're persistent. Research shows that diligent students tend to perform better academically. Research had to show that. Studying makes things easier? Great. Yeah.

Apparently, especially younger students, the more you study, the better you perform academically.

Apparently, especially younger students, the more you study, the better you perform academically.

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Way to go, science. Yeah. And it's obviously a personal trait, right? A crucial trait for achieving long-term goals and success. But let me tell you why I am thinking about diligence today. Oh. And it comes from another podcast. What? There are other podcasts? I didn't know it either until this week. I did some diligent research and it turns out we're not the only one.

Way to go, science. Yeah. And it's obviously a personal trait, right? A crucial trait for achieving long-term goals and success. But let me tell you why I am thinking about diligence today. Oh. And it comes from another podcast. What? There are other podcasts? I didn't know it either until this week. I did some diligent research and it turns out we're not the only one.

I was listening to the Accidental Tech podcast and they were talking about, they have for a long time been talking about TSMC, Taiwan Semiconductor. And I'm going to paraphrase this, but I'll include in the episode, I'll include the audio clip because they had a listener write in saying, about some of their comments about Taiwan Semiconductor in Taiwan.

I was listening to the Accidental Tech podcast and they were talking about, they have for a long time been talking about TSMC, Taiwan Semiconductor. And I'm going to paraphrase this, but I'll include in the episode, I'll include the audio clip because they had a listener write in saying, about some of their comments about Taiwan Semiconductor in Taiwan.

Part of the context of this is around TSMC, the company. They make chips. trying to open a plant in Arizona. And the leadership of TSMC, the Taiwanese leadership, says, you know, we can't get anything done because the Americans don't have the same work ethic that the Taiwanese have.

Part of the context of this is around TSMC, the company. They make chips. trying to open a plant in Arizona. And the leadership of TSMC, the Taiwanese leadership, says, you know, we can't get anything done because the Americans don't have the same work ethic that the Taiwanese have.

You know what? I can do better. TSMC comments about American work ethic. Asic. The American engineers complained of rigid counterproductive hierarchies at the company. Taiwanese TSMC veterans described their American counterparts as lacking the kind of dedication and obedience they believed to be the foundation of their company's world leading success.

You know what? I can do better. TSMC comments about American work ethic. Asic. The American engineers complained of rigid counterproductive hierarchies at the company. Taiwanese TSMC veterans described their American counterparts as lacking the kind of dedication and obedience they believed to be the foundation of their company's world leading success.

One of the complaints was if a machine breaks in Arizona at two in the morning, it'll be fixed sometime the next day. If a machine breaks at two in the morning in Taiwan, it'll be fixed at three in the morning.

One of the complaints was if a machine breaks in Arizona at two in the morning, it'll be fixed sometime the next day. If a machine breaks at two in the morning in Taiwan, it'll be fixed at three in the morning.

And everybody who works there knows that, and this was another bit of the quote that has riled some folks, that the people who work at TSMC in Taiwan, their wives all understand that that is the nature of the work that they do, right? Right. I think by calling out their wives is also an illustration of the cultural divide between our two places.

And everybody who works there knows that, and this was another bit of the quote that has riled some folks, that the people who work at TSMC in Taiwan, their wives all understand that that is the nature of the work that they do, right? Right. I think by calling out their wives is also an illustration of the cultural divide between our two places.

And they're all men.

And they're all men.

No, no, no. It's actually, it's turning the other way because a lot of the legislation is about insourcing and making sure that we're giving, we're growing American jobs. And so, you know, like look at the big EV battery legislation over the last year as part of the Environmental Act that Biden passed. It all included that

No, no, no. It's actually, it's turning the other way because a lot of the legislation is about insourcing and making sure that we're giving, we're growing American jobs. And so, you know, like look at the big EV battery legislation over the last year as part of the Environmental Act that Biden passed. It all included that

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in order to maintain your car as manufacturer, your car's like $7,000 rebate, all of the materials in your batteries had to be sourced from the United States or some, right? I see. And so most of the cars on the EV list no longer had the rebates. It ended up being terrible. All of the materials are being sourced elsewhere. So they're really trying to grow this part.

in order to maintain your car as manufacturer, your car's like $7,000 rebate, all of the materials in your batteries had to be sourced from the United States or some, right? I see. And so most of the cars on the EV list no longer had the rebates. It ended up being terrible. All of the materials are being sourced elsewhere. So they're really trying to grow this part.

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I'm not an expert on that stuff in particular, but this gets us to the clip that I thought was really interesting about Taiwan. And I will play it now.

I'm not an expert on that stuff in particular, but this gets us to the clip that I thought was really interesting about Taiwan. And I will play it now.

This is Ryan Lee. And Ryan writes, Taiwan's work ethic is unique even among Asian standards, and it's related to the second half of your TSMC conversation. It's hard to talk about Taiwan without mentioning geopolitics because it affects every aspect of our lives. I'm coming from a pro-status quo perspective, which is the predominant geopolitical perspective in Taiwan.

This is Ryan Lee. And Ryan writes, Taiwan's work ethic is unique even among Asian standards, and it's related to the second half of your TSMC conversation. It's hard to talk about Taiwan without mentioning geopolitics because it affects every aspect of our lives. I'm coming from a pro-status quo perspective, which is the predominant geopolitical perspective in Taiwan.

It means we don't provoke war, but we believe in the right to defend ourselves if attacked. What does geopolitics have to do with work ethic? The answer is TSMC, but here's the context. To be Taiwanese is to live with an existential threat for every aspect of your life. This existential threat comes from the mainland China's current practices and future threats to diminish us.

It means we don't provoke war, but we believe in the right to defend ourselves if attacked. What does geopolitics have to do with work ethic? The answer is TSMC, but here's the context. To be Taiwanese is to live with an existential threat for every aspect of your life. This existential threat comes from the mainland China's current practices and future threats to diminish us.

China's been very successful in diminishing us. They outpower us in population, size, economy, and military. How does that oppression affect the national mood? There were traditionally two popular perspectives. The pro-China view is that China only allowed us to exist due to its graciousness. The pro-U.S. view is that China hasn't attacked us because the U.S. will save us.

China's been very successful in diminishing us. They outpower us in population, size, economy, and military. How does that oppression affect the national mood? There were traditionally two popular perspectives. The pro-China view is that China only allowed us to exist due to its graciousness. The pro-U.S. view is that China hasn't attacked us because the U.S. will save us.

Ironically, both perspectives are self-diminutive. But then TSMC changed everything. Now there's a third perspective, one that is neither pro-China nor pro-U.S., but rather pro-Taiwanese. TSMC becomes so integral to this third perspective that it even has a name, Hugo Shenshan. It's roughly translated as war deterrence by economics.

Ironically, both perspectives are self-diminutive. But then TSMC changed everything. Now there's a third perspective, one that is neither pro-China nor pro-U.S., but rather pro-Taiwanese. TSMC becomes so integral to this third perspective that it even has a name, Hugo Shenshan. It's roughly translated as war deterrence by economics.

The idea behind this is solidified by the 2020 chip supply chain crisis. A war with Taiwan would cause a global economic crisis at such an unparalleled scale that Taiwan has made itself indispensable to American interests. War with Taiwan would be too costly for any party. So how does TSMC's success translate to the Taiwanese work ethic? TSMC's success is viewed as Taiwanese self-actualization.

The idea behind this is solidified by the 2020 chip supply chain crisis. A war with Taiwan would cause a global economic crisis at such an unparalleled scale that Taiwan has made itself indispensable to American interests. War with Taiwan would be too costly for any party. So how does TSMC's success translate to the Taiwanese work ethic? TSMC's success is viewed as Taiwanese self-actualization.

Hugo Shenshan is part of a general narrative. If you work hard, then you save your freedom and democracy. Mind you, this is just a narrative you'll find in the media and family gatherings. In reality, I know people who hate their jobs in media tech and other tech companies. But the narrative persists and is a pervasive part of work culture.

Hugo Shenshan is part of a general narrative. If you work hard, then you save your freedom and democracy. Mind you, this is just a narrative you'll find in the media and family gatherings. In reality, I know people who hate their jobs in media tech and other tech companies. But the narrative persists and is a pervasive part of work culture.

My cousin who works at TSMC is viewed in the family as a national hero. Where else can you replicate a work culture so motivated by an existential threat? There's no equitable stakes in America. So when TSMC announced their factory in Arizona, Taiwanese people knew it wasn't going to work out.

My cousin who works at TSMC is viewed in the family as a national hero. Where else can you replicate a work culture so motivated by an existential threat? There's no equitable stakes in America. So when TSMC announced their factory in Arizona, Taiwanese people knew it wasn't going to work out.

So that was Casey List reading feedback to their podcast about their conversation on TSMC. I think it's really fascinating, this whole idea that... that it's their national identity is tied to the diligence of their workforce. Right. They're national heroes by going to work at their chip plants. And I think that is just bonkers because I don't think we are motivated the same way.

So that was Casey List reading feedback to their podcast about their conversation on TSMC. I think it's really fascinating, this whole idea that... that it's their national identity is tied to the diligence of their workforce. Right. They're national heroes by going to work at their chip plants. And I think that is just bonkers because I don't think we are motivated the same way.

That seems to be a massive rift, a massive difference in how we see what diligence really looks like.

That seems to be a massive rift, a massive difference in how we see what diligence really looks like.

Well, I can't answer that specifically because they didn't talk about that. The context was around the chip plant, but that is a major, like manufacturing technology is such a major industry there that it's not just TSMC, it's all of the associated industries. It is a it it is taken diligence to this. It's not just a professional trait, but a cultural value.

Well, I can't answer that specifically because they didn't talk about that. The context was around the chip plant, but that is a major, like manufacturing technology is such a major industry there that it's not just TSMC, it's all of the associated industries. It is a it it is taken diligence to this. It's not just a professional trait, but a cultural value.

It's rooted in Confucian ethics and emphasizes, you know, this kind of work ethic. And I don't remember the last time I felt so strongly about going to work.

It's rooted in Confucian ethics and emphasizes, you know, this kind of work ethic. And I don't remember the last time I felt so strongly about going to work.

Yeah, to a point of national pride.

Yeah, to a point of national pride.

The chips are in everything. They're in the medical equipment, they're in everything. And, and so I, that I think is interesting to me. What is it like, as you just reflect on, In Taiwan, it's a point of national pride and political and economic power to go to work for the country.

The chips are in everything. They're in the medical equipment, they're in everything. And, and so I, that I think is interesting to me. What is it like, as you just reflect on, In Taiwan, it's a point of national pride and political and economic power to go to work for the country.

What is it that we have, do you think, that American companies motivate, or I'll say companies in the West, motivate to that same level? Do you think there is an argument that business leaders make that could motivate American workforce to the same level?

What is it that we have, do you think, that American companies motivate, or I'll say companies in the West, motivate to that same level? Do you think there is an argument that business leaders make that could motivate American workforce to the same level?

Is that what it takes? Do you know, like, is that what it takes to actually have that level of national pride in the work that you do every day, going to a chip plant? Like we have people who go to chip plants every day. I kind of wish we could hear from some of them. If you work at a chip plant, do you feel like you are a national hero in your family? I want to know the answer to that here.

Is that what it takes? Do you know, like, is that what it takes to actually have that level of national pride in the work that you do every day, going to a chip plant? Like we have people who go to chip plants every day. I kind of wish we could hear from some of them. If you work at a chip plant, do you feel like you are a national hero in your family? I want to know the answer to that here.

If you work at Intel, I just don't know what that looks like. And I don't want to say that I don't appreciate hard work. I feel like my history with diligence and hard work didn't start with this national identity or this ideology that probably started in school and people worked real hard. Like I was a nut in school. Like I did not know what I wanted to do.

If you work at Intel, I just don't know what that looks like. And I don't want to say that I don't appreciate hard work. I feel like my history with diligence and hard work didn't start with this national identity or this ideology that probably started in school and people worked real hard. Like I was a nut in school. Like I did not know what I wanted to do.