A former rival of President Donald Trump’s now holds four positions in his administration. How Marco Rubio became important at work. This episode was produced by Devan Schwartz, edited by Jolie Myers, fact-checked by Laura Bullard, engineered by Patrick Boyd and Andrea Kristinsdottir, and hosted by Sean Rameswaram. Listen to Today, Explained ad-free by becoming a Vox Member: vox.com/members. Transcript at vox.com/today-explained-podcast. Photo of Secretary Marco Rubio by Francis Chung/Politico/Bloomberg via Getty Images. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Chapter 1: What roles does Marco Rubio hold in the Trump administration?
Also, Marco's the acting head of USAID, which you might recall from early February when USAID was disappearing. The fourth one's the toughest, though. Marco Rubio somehow managed to become our nation's chief archivist. Our biggest question today explained is, does he make forced salaries?
I don't know. We've been, like, there are people, reporters, trying to find out the answer to that question.
All right, but we still have a bunch of other lingering questions, like, how? Why? What? Answers ahead on the show.
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Chapter 2: How did Marco Rubio gain Trump's trust?
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Marco!
Nihal Toosi wrote about how Marco Rubio became so important at work for Politico.
Well, in a way, he did it by not being Marco Rubio. He kind of... abandoned everything that he, or much of what he has stood for in the past, endeared himself to Trump, supported the president vocally and through policy changes, and just, you know, earn the president's trust.
The president has made his argument as to why he thinks Canada would be better off joining the United States for economic purposes. The president rightly has concluded that the current status of global trade is bad for America and good for a bunch of other people, and he's going to reset it, and he's absolutely right to do it.
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Chapter 3: What has changed in Marco Rubio's political stance?
I will also say it's also kind of hard to get into the Trump circle. There's not a lot of people who meet the loyalty test. And Rubio has proven that he can do that. The reason that it's important to point this out is because when he took the initial position of secretary of state, many people viewed him as one of the weakest in Trump's orbit.
I wrote an entire column about how all these people in town were saying, he is not going to last very long. He won't last even six months as Secretary of State. And so the fact that he has climbed the ranks and taken all these positions and earned the president's trust in such a way, that is really remarkable.
But it just goes to show how unrecognizable he is compared to what Marco Rubio was, you know, five, ten years ago.
That's what's so interesting here, I think, right? Because Marco Rubio's been around a long time. When you hear... candidate Donald Trump talking about draining the Washington swamp. It's like people like Marco Rubio, who you could almost picture as representing the swamp.
There were reports that he was asking President Biden for more funding for USAID before he became one of the faces of the elimination of USAID. He is not exactly... MAGA. And are you saying that there hasn't been much tension there between Rubio and Trump?
Well, you know, Rubio is, I wouldn't say he's like a traditional, traditional Republican. Like he kind of came in on a wave of reactionariness to the establishment. But he, over time, established his bona fides in the Senate as a hawkish Republican, pro-human rights, pro-democracy promotion.
I've never met Vladimir Putin, but I know enough about him to know he's a gangster. He's basically an organized crime figure that runs a country, controls a $2 trillion economy, and is using it to build up his military in a rapid way, despite the fact his economy is a disaster.
Definitely pro-humanitarian assistance.
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Chapter 4: Why is Marco Rubio's position as Secretary of State significant?
Anybody who tells you that we can slash foreign aid and that will bring us to balance is lying to you. Foreign aid is less than 1% of our budget. It's just not true.
The type of guy who supported Ukraine.
I think the first and most important thing we need to do is we have to help the Ukrainian people.
wants to be tough on dictatorships around the world, including Iran. And he ran against President Trump in 2016 for the presidency. And the president, Trump back then, nicknamed him.
Little Marco, I will. Well, let's hear a big, big don. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it, Little Marco. Gentlemen.
But I would say he also has proven to be a very flexible type of politician. Over the last several years, he has moderated his positions. My understanding is he's gone out and learned a lot about the American heartland. He's from Florida. And he's a little bit more of a restrainer than he was in the past. But, you know, now that he has joined—
the Trump team, he has really gone to the MAGA world to the point where even like far right influencers like Laura Loomer are now praising Marco Rubio.
I was just sitting here thinking, wow, Marco Rubio is on a generational comeback from 2016. Who knew we would be Marco fans nine years later?
Just would not have happened, honestly, even a couple of years ago. I mean, it really shows how far the transition of Marco Rubio, the change has really accelerated since he has joined the Trump administration.
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Chapter 5: What challenges does Marco Rubio face in his multiple roles?
Don't come here and create a such scenario where you're going to start lecturing us about how diplomacy isn't going to work. President Zelensky took it in that direction and it ended in a predictable outcome as a result.
But wasn't Rubio maybe one of the only cabinet members in that meeting who looked sort of uncomfortable? Wasn't that the vibe?
He looked like he was sinking into the couch. But afterward, he got on TV, he went public, he defended the president. He realized immediately, okay, I have to speak out or it's going to look like I'm not supportive of President Trump and I have to be subordinate to him. Look, another area where he's really, really been like, astonishingly pro-Trump is the anti-immigration stuff.
And this is really remarkable for Rubio because he has often touted his own family's immigrant story. They're from Cuba.
Well, my parents came to this country because they were looking for a better life.
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Chapter 6: How does Marco Rubio's immigration stance reflect his background?
And now he is seemingly gleefully stripping students of their visas and... You know, negotiating deals that are sending people to a prison in El Salvador without them getting proper hearings in court. And he's even suggesting he'll defy the judges if they request information in support of Trump.
You've been in touch with El Salvador about returning Abrego Garcia. Has a formal request from this administration been made?
Well, I would never tell you that. And you know who else I'll never tell? A judge. Because the conduct of our foreign policy belongs to the president of the United States and the executive branch, not some judge.
So it's like some of these things you think, wow, does he have to go this far? But obviously it's working for him in terms of surviving under Trump. But who knows? Like a month from now, Marco Rubio may be out of favor. you just don't really know what's going to happen. I think a lot of people thought that Mike Waltz, the national security advisor who was pushed out, would last longer than he did.
So now that Rubio is actually in charge of these key portfolios, national security advisor and the State Department, in a way he has a bigger target on his back too, right? Because he's going to be responsible for any major crisis that happens.
Yeah, so this is the job he most recently acquired, Donald Trump's chief national security advisor. What exactly does that entail?
So the national security advisor is based at the White House, and they basically are kind of like a point guard. They keep an eye on what all the agencies are thinking. They coordinate things. And they bring together options for the president when it comes to foreign policy and national security issues.
Now, that's if they kind of do it in the way that's considered proper, which is to be an honest broker, to be the guy that says, look, here's what state is thinking. Here's what DOD is thinking. Here's what the CIA wants. A lot of national security advisors acquire more power than that. They very much have their own points of view. They do their own negotiations.
They kind of rival other people in the administration for power. And that's kind of always caused a bit of tension in past administrations. So, you know, we definitely could have seen like Rubio at odds with a national security advisor in the future. But now it would be like being at odds with himself.
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Chapter 7: What impact will Marco Rubio's policies have on national security?
Look, I think if he survives in the roles for several months or over a year, that is an accomplishment. Under President Trump, survival is difficult. He has a constant turnover in the past. In terms of other accomplishments, look, whether it is as National Security Advisor or Secretary of State or the National Archivist, for all I know,
If this administration were to strike important deals with Iran, say over its nuclear program, or bring about some sort of a peace between Russia and Ukraine, these are things that they can point to as accomplishments. I do want to point out there is another major player in terms of foreign policy right now, and that's Steve Witkoff. He's a special envoy for the president.
He's actually the lead on portfolios like Iran and Ukraine. But Rubio now in particular can very much have a major role in those as well. And ultimately, look, ultimately, the president is the one who's going to take the credit for the accomplishments. And knowing how Rubio is operating, he will definitely see the limelight to the president.
Read Nahal Tusi at politico.com. President Trump said he'd solve Russia-Ukraine on day one. How Trump, Marko, and Witkow are doing there on day 107 when we return on Today Explained. Support for today explained comes from Shopify. Entrepreneurs know that when you're building a business, you have to wear too many hats.
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