Alistair Campbell

And we, of course, covered 2022 to 23, which was Masa Amini, which was the huge demonstration after the killing of a woman who refused to wear a headscarf.

All of those times, Iranians outside the country have assumed this was the end of the regime.

And on none of those occasions was it.

However, this time it may be,

One of the amazing things we're talking about here, I guess, which we almost might want to get our colleagues and the rest is history involved, is this question of revolutions and when a regime falls and when it doesn't.

And basically, the story often is these regimes are completely secure.

totally in place until in an instant, they suddenly aren't.

Bashar al-Assad is a good example.

Absolutely.

A lot of people were on the record back just over a year ago saying, he's never going to be toppled.

Don't be ridiculous.

There's no way a small group of Al-Qaeda fighters from the Northwest are going to be able to take the whole country.

And of course, regimes, when they want to really oppress people, they can do it.

We saw it in Czechoslovakia and Hungary during the Cold War.

And then we saw the opposite, of course, in 1989, where regimes that seemed like East German regime, you know, with millions of people in the stars that you suddenly fold.

So what are the only ways of trying to work out what the likelihood is here?

I think the first thing is to look at ideology.

So one of the things that's different about this regime compared to, you know, the communist regimes in Poland or Hungary in 1989 is that the ideology is still very strong.

Amongst the true believers, there still is a hard core of clergymen, Revolutionary Guards people, the Basij militia, which is more of a kind of village level extremist militia.

13 million of them voted for the more hardline candidate in the last elections.