Andrew Gallimore

And it's like, actually, no, it is possible to have safe and clean.

And Tokyo is fascinating because it's an example of what's often called an emergent city.

They don't have this very strict zoning rule.

where, oh, here it's got to be offices, here it's got to be houses, here it's got to be small businesses or anything like that.

It's like it's all mixed together and different kind of neighbourhoods kind of just emerge.

You know, there's a knife district, for example.

People who sell knives, they all gather together.

There's a bookshop district.

There's, you know, districts for all different things, not because someone has decided, oh, only bookshops can be here.

It's just that they tend to gather together.

And so, you know, you walk around Tokyo and you might, you'll find yourself in some quiet alley and you'll have little houses and then you'll have a little store, often very, very tiny stores that have been perhaps operating for decades.

And in the UK, or I guess in the States as well, they would have gone under.

decades ago, you know, the city would have just crushed them.

But it seems very easy in Tokyo to kind of open a small... If you have a house and you own it in Tokyo, you can, by law, you can convert the first floor into a store.

You'll get these little old ladies who will... They bought their house decades ago, they're retired, and they think, oh, what can I do with my time?

I know, I'll open a cafe.

And they say they open a little cafe.

Hardly anyone goes, maybe.

It could be in the countryside.

It could be on the outskirts or whatever.