Anne Applebaum
๐ค SpeakerAppearances Over Time
Podcast Appearances
I don't think anyone expects the U.S. to pull out of NATO because that would create a kind of drama that I don't think President Trump wants. But I think it's important that people understand that NATO is psychological as much as it is an alliance. NATO is a system of deterrence. It's an agreement that, based on the famous Article 5 of the NATO Treaty,
I don't think anyone expects the U.S. to pull out of NATO because that would create a kind of drama that I don't think President Trump wants. But I think it's important that people understand that NATO is psychological as much as it is an alliance. NATO is a system of deterrence. It's an agreement that, based on the famous Article 5 of the NATO Treaty,
I don't think anyone expects the U.S. to pull out of NATO because that would create a kind of drama that I don't think President Trump wants. But I think it's important that people understand that NATO is psychological as much as it is an alliance. NATO is a system of deterrence. It's an agreement that, based on the famous Article 5 of the NATO Treaty,
It's an agreement that if one country is attacked, then all the other countries in the alliance are obliged to consider coming to its defense. Once nobody believes anymore in that promise, then even if NATO still exists as an institution and even if it still has troops on the ground, its value as a deterrent does become more limited.
It's an agreement that if one country is attacked, then all the other countries in the alliance are obliged to consider coming to its defense. Once nobody believes anymore in that promise, then even if NATO still exists as an institution and even if it still has troops on the ground, its value as a deterrent does become more limited.
It's an agreement that if one country is attacked, then all the other countries in the alliance are obliged to consider coming to its defense. Once nobody believes anymore in that promise, then even if NATO still exists as an institution and even if it still has troops on the ground, its value as a deterrent does become more limited.
So I think the fear is that the United States will begin to say and do things that convince Russia that the deterrent is no longer valid. And that simply means they're vulnerable.
So I think the fear is that the United States will begin to say and do things that convince Russia that the deterrent is no longer valid. And that simply means they're vulnerable.
So I think the fear is that the United States will begin to say and do things that convince Russia that the deterrent is no longer valid. And that simply means they're vulnerable.
So to be clear, Europeans do have armies. Europeans have contributed half of all the aid that has gone to Ukraine since the war has begun. many Europeans have invested heavily in their armies and in their militaries over the last three years since the war started. It's not as if they have nothing.
So to be clear, Europeans do have armies. Europeans have contributed half of all the aid that has gone to Ukraine since the war has begun. many Europeans have invested heavily in their armies and in their militaries over the last three years since the war started. It's not as if they have nothing.
So to be clear, Europeans do have armies. Europeans have contributed half of all the aid that has gone to Ukraine since the war has begun. many Europeans have invested heavily in their armies and in their militaries over the last three years since the war started. It's not as if they have nothing.
But the way NATO is constructed, the way many European military systems are constructed, it is with the idea that the U.S. leads. And that's, of course, been of tremendous advantage to the U.S. It means that Europeans buy American military equipment. It means they defer to the United States on all kinds of decisions.
But the way NATO is constructed, the way many European military systems are constructed, it is with the idea that the U.S. leads. And that's, of course, been of tremendous advantage to the U.S. It means that Europeans buy American military equipment. It means they defer to the United States on all kinds of decisions.
But the way NATO is constructed, the way many European military systems are constructed, it is with the idea that the U.S. leads. And that's, of course, been of tremendous advantage to the U.S. It means that Europeans buy American military equipment. It means they defer to the United States on all kinds of decisions.
And the United States is the main decider in all kinds of security and economic and other contexts. If the United States pulls out rapidly or the American deterrent disappears rapidly, then it's not clear that Europe is immediately prepared to defend itself. But there was a meeting in Paris on Monday
And the United States is the main decider in all kinds of security and economic and other contexts. If the United States pulls out rapidly or the American deterrent disappears rapidly, then it's not clear that Europe is immediately prepared to defend itself. But there was a meeting in Paris on Monday
And the United States is the main decider in all kinds of security and economic and other contexts. If the United States pulls out rapidly or the American deterrent disappears rapidly, then it's not clear that Europe is immediately prepared to defend itself. But there was a meeting in Paris on Monday
That was the beginning of what I think will be a conversation about how Europe is going to respond in this new situation.
That was the beginning of what I think will be a conversation about how Europe is going to respond in this new situation.