Azeem Azhar

There is some know-how that is going to get lost when you swap out an anthropic model for a Kimi or a Quinn model.

Well, there may well be an IPO for OpenAI this year or early next year.

So there'll be something to mark our homework against.

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That's all for now, and I'll catch you next time.

Today, I'm welcoming Mustafa Suleiman, the CEO of Microsoft AI, the founder of Inflection AI, and the co-founder of DeepMind.

And for the past few months, he has been sounding an alarm about artificial intelligence, about the way some AI systems are being developed, and about why that particular trajectory has little to offer, perhaps but woe and worry.

Let's get started.

Welcome, Mustafa.

It's great to see you.

It's been a long time.

Yeah, it's been a while.

Thanks for having me.

I'm excited for this conversation.

You and I have spent a lot of time thinking about some similar things and we agree on a lot of them, but that's really boring for all of those people who are listening.

Let's maybe lay out where I think we agree, and then we'll get to a sort of a knotty space.

We're in this weird time.

The world is changing because of technology, and many of the fictions that we've used to coordinate human behavior are under strain.

By fictions, I mean the shared stories that allow us to cooperate from money and nations and corporations and credentials and jobs.