Bob Webster

I think I first learned of it in the newspaper. And then I came to learn that we had an open investigation on Terry Hoffman involving some shenanigans in the bankruptcy court.

You know, the Cleavers were very, very active. They took a very aggressive role to try and seek justice.

I, of course, knew that there was a lot of smoke. There was background. There was noise associated with the defendant that undoubtedly was motivating the government.

You know, we were not prosecuting a cult. We were not prosecuting evil. We were prosecuting somebody that we believe defrauded the bankruptcy court.

I can't tell you which end of the spectrum that is. I think it, you know, I drove by her house every day that I drove home. And, you know, it looked like it had needed a new roof for the last 10 years. Lawnscaping was ill-kept. I struggled with exactly that kind of attempt to get an understanding of what sort of defendant she was or would be.

It's not unusual in my experience for FBI agents and government prosecutors to give more credit to defendants than they deserve, you know, in being masterminds, in being evil. You know, quite often they are just sad figures.

There were essentially three indictments in the case. You know, I think an expert in federal criminal prosecutions would say that that's a red flag.

We didn't even try hard to even go down the road of having the noise, the mumbo-jumbo admitted at trial. She didn't take the stand, so we couldn't even inquire.

You know, it's a singular event, almost a singular event, to have a criminal case thrown out by the Court of Appeals in the Fifth Circuit. You remember every one of those that you ever had to suffer. And honestly, it's the only case that I was ever in that resulted in a complete dismissal of the case for essentially the government not stating a crime.

I don't recall the specific circumstances of Roger Simon's participation in the case, but if she was parking assets, knowing that if they cleared bankruptcy and she was going to be able to get to him on the rebound after the bankruptcy, he would be complicit, of course, in a bankruptcy fraud. I don't think we ever explored that possibility.