Carl Heneghan

What I slightly have a problem with all of this is there's just too many asks within it.

And I think it'd be interesting to think of paring them down and trying to think, right, what's achievable as opposed to this is just another statement and we go round and round for another 20 years and we revisit this.

Well, I have been thinking about this.

One of the things, although we support calls for more research on the effects of industry entanglement and strategies to end it, I don't support more calls for research.

I think this is a real to step back time, actually, and really think through what do we want to achieve.

And the one that was interesting to me was this issue around educational activities for health professionals to end the reliance on industry funding and end financial relationships between their leadership and industry.

And that's because I think that's where it all stems from, the problems.

And the idea of having a sort of national fund that you could draw on to go to the events which were independent, where you could reflect on practice, I think would be a really important change.

and allow people to have a much more thoughtful process about thinking about the complexity of healthcare without having somebody market the latest drug to you that might influence your practice.

The thing is, though, is this is the point if you go to fees talk, as I said, is that it's almost like the BMJ and many people have been going around in circles for about 20 years and are coming to a point where this is a real issue.

But actually, if you don't start with something right at sort of the roots of the problem...

you're unlikely to then to grow up to where all the branches of the complex issues are.

So I'm saying go right back down to where the problem exists.

It starts at the beginning with training and education.

Fundamentally the relationship.

Yeah, but that distorted evidence base comes out of people who've been trained in a certain way and educated in a certain way.

I'm sort of coming, I'm feeling very organic today, nurturing them, you know, at the point of germination of all the problems.

Where do they arise from?

And so at this point, if you can fix some of these issues, but if all we're doing is going to more events...

where people are marketing more at us.