Carlotta Gall

And then this sparked the introduction of really radical extremist jihadist groups. The most well-known and largest was Islamic State. It got very, very brutal in Syria. It has a brutal past, but this was something on a different scale. And then Assad doubled down. He gassed civilians in some of the war to take control back of some of the cities.

And then this sparked the introduction of really radical extremist jihadist groups. The most well-known and largest was Islamic State. It got very, very brutal in Syria. It has a brutal past, but this was something on a different scale. And then Assad doubled down. He gassed civilians in some of the war to take control back of some of the cities.

And then, you know, millions were displaced, fleeing the country, fleeing a lot into Turkey and Lebanon and neighboring countries and, you know, heading for Europe or anywhere they could. It was really a most ghastly civil war. And by 2014, hundreds of thousands had been killed and wounded. At this point, who is winning that war? Well, that's the interesting thing.

And then, you know, millions were displaced, fleeing the country, fleeing a lot into Turkey and Lebanon and neighboring countries and, you know, heading for Europe or anywhere they could. It was really a most ghastly civil war. And by 2014, hundreds of thousands had been killed and wounded. At this point, who is winning that war? Well, that's the interesting thing.

Assad, for all his brutal repression, is actually barely hanging on. And that's when we started to see other countries that have stakes in Syria start to get involved. Right.

Assad, for all his brutal repression, is actually barely hanging on. And that's when we started to see other countries that have stakes in Syria start to get involved. Right.

Yes. So ISIS was a huge concern, especially for the West. They were already in Iraq and they were expanding their territory and they were recruiting massively. So that's when, in 2014, American troops entered the fray, particularly to fight ISIS and to repress this very, very virulent jihadist group that was obviously interested in attacking Western countries. And so what happened next?

Yes. So ISIS was a huge concern, especially for the West. They were already in Iraq and they were expanding their territory and they were recruiting massively. So that's when, in 2014, American troops entered the fray, particularly to fight ISIS and to repress this very, very virulent jihadist group that was obviously interested in attacking Western countries. And so what happened next?

Who's the next big player that comes on the scene? So there were actually two big players that came in the scene, and they came in on the side of Assad. That was Russia and Iran. And Russia came in in a very big way with, you know, serious firepower, planes, jets, fighter bombers, weaponry, and a lot of advice and tactics. And they brought ships into the ports and so on.

Who's the next big player that comes on the scene? So there were actually two big players that came in the scene, and they came in on the side of Assad. That was Russia and Iran. And Russia came in in a very big way with, you know, serious firepower, planes, jets, fighter bombers, weaponry, and a lot of advice and tactics. And they brought ships into the ports and so on.

And then Iran had the foot soldiers on the ground. There were a lot of them who came in from Iran. But they also had Hezbollah, very experienced, very accomplished fighters who came in from Lebanon. And the Iranians sent in advisors and military advisors who ran the campaign. So they really did a great amount of actually retaking territory for the Assad regime.

And then Iran had the foot soldiers on the ground. There were a lot of them who came in from Iran. But they also had Hezbollah, very experienced, very accomplished fighters who came in from Lebanon. And the Iranians sent in advisors and military advisors who ran the campaign. So they really did a great amount of actually retaking territory for the Assad regime.

So they, for both Iran and Russia, it was very important to see the Assad regime survive. Russia had long had relations with Syria, going back right through the communist times. And so they wanted to be able to keep their access to the Mediterranean, their trade, their diplomatic influence. And Iran had an equally important reason to be involved.

So they, for both Iran and Russia, it was very important to see the Assad regime survive. Russia had long had relations with Syria, going back right through the communist times. And so they wanted to be able to keep their access to the Mediterranean, their trade, their diplomatic influence. And Iran had an equally important reason to be involved.

They couched it in religious terms, but it was very clearly a geopolitical desire to have good relations with Syria and influence, but also to have a very important land bridge through Syria to their allies Hezbollah, the militia in Lebanon. So for those reasons, they also wanted to see Assad survive.

They couched it in religious terms, but it was very clearly a geopolitical desire to have good relations with Syria and influence, but also to have a very important land bridge through Syria to their allies Hezbollah, the militia in Lebanon. So for those reasons, they also wanted to see Assad survive.

Absolutely. And those two powers, Iran and Russia, are propping up Assad. He's in power, but he's got all these rebel groups around the country pushed to the edges. And it's since 2016, it's been like locked.

Absolutely. And those two powers, Iran and Russia, are propping up Assad. He's in power, but he's got all these rebel groups around the country pushed to the edges. And it's since 2016, it's been like locked.

So the biggest change of course was the two main backers of Assad, Russia and Iran, became massively distracted by other events and weakened. It was the wars in other countries. that caused this. Russia is engaged in a really tough war in Ukraine, and they've had to move troops out of Syria, deploy them in Ukraine. They've expended all their efforts and men and money and weapons on that war.

So the biggest change of course was the two main backers of Assad, Russia and Iran, became massively distracted by other events and weakened. It was the wars in other countries. that caused this. Russia is engaged in a really tough war in Ukraine, and they've had to move troops out of Syria, deploy them in Ukraine. They've expended all their efforts and men and money and weapons on that war.