Chris Johns

And I must say, Jim, I'm coming around to your way of thinking.

I was really, yeah, they're going to have to, you know,

do a lot on interest rates it's a big if that Iran war thing but if there is a sign that he's coming to an end I'd be tempted to be more in your camp now Jim I'm doing something that I rarely do I'm coming around to your way of thinking

If you keep on building these data centres, where's the electricity going to come from is the obvious question to ask.

But what you're saying there, Jim, I'm going to draw probably a very bizarre and unjustified parallel or dotted line between immigration and data centers.

As economists, we know that immigration is generally a good thing.

We know that there are lots of people around the world who are now running global multinational companies or running countries that they weren't born in.

We know that we have people like Rishi Sunak, who I mentioned earlier on, who is British, but his parents weren't.

Immigration produces all these kinds of great people.

Immigrants run our health services and our care homes and staff other important jobs, sectors.

And we talk a lot about the positive things that immigration brings.

And we can also talk about the positive cultural changes that immigrants bring.

You know, our food has changed because of immigration, mostly, I think, for the better.

And we could go on and on and on.

But the zeitgeist here in the UK certainly is we don't like immigrants.

That's why we're voting for reform.

And so as a politician rather than an economist, this is what you've got to try and

deal with, face up to, encounter.

And using the economic logic of the positive benefits of immigration clearly hasn't worked.

So we have to try something different.