Dan Epps

Typically.

So, you know, it's a non-trivial cost.

Okay.

It's called Martinization because the court first did this in the certiorari context to a guy named Martin.

And so now he has the indignity of having this procedure attached to his name.

That does sound vaguely familiar, but it's not something I've ever researched, and it's not something I recall ever having

To have done, to have had done to my clothing?

Do you have any sense of what it means?

Yeah, but I mean, I guess if it's cert-specific, though, as I understand it.

So we had one of these.

Pretty common.

And, you know, my memory is when you're in the cert pool as a clerk, you write a lot of memos saying deny, and sometimes you would say deny IFP, or sometimes you would say, you know, describe it as frivolous in the memo.

And after a certain number of those, the recommendation would become, you know...

frivolous you know deny and cut them off yeah so we did that to mr howell who is a prisoner in indiana

And Justice, everyone is okay with it, apparently, or at least not objecting to it, other than Justice Jackson, who has a six-and-a-half-page dissent.

Yeah, and she's picking up a banner previously carried by Justice Stevens, right, who was a dissenter in Martin and always, I think, my memory is he would just routinely dissent from Martinization orders.

Is that faint praise or is that just speaking to your enthusiasm?

People complained that we were too mean to Justice Jackson before.

So you're picking this.

No comment about that.