David Marchese

You were saying? So the old strategy also was whenever we are ready to go into a negotiation to end the war, It will be nothing about Ukraine without Ukraine. And that means that the Ukrainians will be at the center of the negotiation. And no one's going to give away their country the way one did in colonial times. This is going to be the Ukrainians working it out with the Russians.

That's right. And imperialism will not be rewarded meant that Vladimir Putin couldn't come away from this with more land or a better situation than he had before. Vladimir Putin couldn't come away from this in a situation where he would be ready a few years from now to finish the job and take the rest of Ukraine. So fast forward to what happened. After dancing around each other for weeks,

That's right. And imperialism will not be rewarded meant that Vladimir Putin couldn't come away from this with more land or a better situation than he had before. Vladimir Putin couldn't come away from this in a situation where he would be ready a few years from now to finish the job and take the rest of Ukraine. So fast forward to what happened. After dancing around each other for weeks,

Putin and President Trump finally get on the phone for 90 minutes. When it's all done, Trump comes out and says, we're on the way to a peace deal. There's going to be a negotiation. Missing from all of this, the Europeans and the Ukrainians. Right. And we're talking to you on Thursday midday.

Putin and President Trump finally get on the phone for 90 minutes. When it's all done, Trump comes out and says, we're on the way to a peace deal. There's going to be a negotiation. Missing from all of this, the Europeans and the Ukrainians. Right. And we're talking to you on Thursday midday.

But earlier in the day here in Europe, Zelensky came out and said, I'm not going along with any agreement about my country that I'm not involved in negotiating.

But earlier in the day here in Europe, Zelensky came out and said, I'm not going along with any agreement about my country that I'm not involved in negotiating.

And, you know, what else it does is it takes you back to what Donald Trump has been saying was his favorite era, right? The McKinley era, the 1890s, where we're taking lands, in that case, the Philippines, Guam, and so forth. Now what he wants is Greenland, the Panama Canal, and to own Gaza. But what that really tells you is that everything that we have done since World War II

And, you know, what else it does is it takes you back to what Donald Trump has been saying was his favorite era, right? The McKinley era, the 1890s, where we're taking lands, in that case, the Philippines, Guam, and so forth. Now what he wants is Greenland, the Panama Canal, and to own Gaza. But what that really tells you is that everything that we have done since World War II

to build up alliances and basically establish that people should ally with the United States on a basis of principle, not on basis of American power, is out the window.

to build up alliances and basically establish that people should ally with the United States on a basis of principle, not on basis of American power, is out the window.

Michael, there's another through line. Think of the Ukrainians and think of the Palestinians. So in both cases, they're, in Trump's mind, not major players here. They are pawns to be moved around. Trump has never once, since he's raised this idea, gone and tackled the question that the Geneva Convention actually forbids the mass movement of ethnic groups

Michael, there's another through line. Think of the Ukrainians and think of the Palestinians. So in both cases, they're, in Trump's mind, not major players here. They are pawns to be moved around. Trump has never once, since he's raised this idea, gone and tackled the question that the Geneva Convention actually forbids the mass movement of ethnic groups

So he views international treaties, international law as obstacles to his plan. And the way he's going to get past it, he believes, is by pressuring allies over whom he's got some leverage. And that would be, in this case, Jordan and Egypt. Right.

So he views international treaties, international law as obstacles to his plan. And the way he's going to get past it, he believes, is by pressuring allies over whom he's got some leverage. And that would be, in this case, Jordan and Egypt. Right.

As I was getting off the plane here from Munich, I ran into a European diplomat I'd known for a long time. And we were discussing this dynamic, what we've seen in Ukraine, what we've seen in Gaza. And he said, you know, it goes back to Thucydides, who wrote the history of the Peloponnesian War.

As I was getting off the plane here from Munich, I ran into a European diplomat I'd known for a long time. And we were discussing this dynamic, what we've seen in Ukraine, what we've seen in Gaza. And he said, you know, it goes back to Thucydides, who wrote the history of the Peloponnesian War.

And that famous quote we all had to learn in 11th grade, which is the powerful do whatever they can and the weak do whatever they must. I'm sure I've got the phrasing slightly wrong there. But that's the world that Donald Trump sees at home and abroad.

And that famous quote we all had to learn in 11th grade, which is the powerful do whatever they can and the weak do whatever they must. I'm sure I've got the phrasing slightly wrong there. But that's the world that Donald Trump sees at home and abroad.

From The New York Times, this is The Interview. I'm David Marchese. So many of Denzel Washington's greatest performances have been defined by a riveting sense of authority, an absence of any pandering or need to be liked. There's something deep down inside his characters that feels unassailable, a little enigmatic, and theirs alone.