Dawn Russell

So it's incorrect to think that it's any safer than any of the drugs you see that people who are sleeping rough are using.

Yes, and we know it to be a fact.

I mean, last year, the Health Research Board released the treatment figures for last year.

Over 15,000 people sought treatment for their drug use, and the most prevalent drug that they sought treatment for was powder cocaine.

But also our colleagues in the HSE run wastewater analysis, which is a national programme where they analyse the wastewater to see what drugs are in them.

And we know from that that cocaine is prevalent across every community in Ireland, and it was the highest presenting drug in wastewater.

It's an incredibly complex area, Clare.

To oversimplify decriminalisation would be risky.

Removal of Section 3 of the Misuse of Drugs Act would make it legal to carry drugs for your personal use.

But what you would need to have, if that were to happen, and if that were to be the approach that Ireland would take, you would need to have incredibly robust treatment services in place to support those people who do fall into problem addiction.

And one of the things that Anna Liffey are quite worried about, and our colleagues in the Department of Health are worried too,

is that the figures I gave you earlier from treatment, that's only the people we're reaching.

There are millions of people in Ireland and there are people who aren't reaching out for help.

And sometimes people from the social backgrounds that we've discussed, you know, more middle class or holding down jobs, they might feel shame and stigma and they may not want to reach out to a drug treatment centre.

So we would really need to overcome that to support people if we liberalise drug laws.

Yes, yes.

I'm from a very rural community in Tipperary.

And in my experience of socialising, cocaine and gambling go hand in hand now.

You know, any kind of Saturday evening, if you go to watch the sports in the pub, there's people of all ages, you know, my age and my 40s as well, engaging in that kind of substance use and gambling and high risk activities.

And one of the big risks that we see from the Anna Liffey's point of view for public health in Ireland