Deborah Oles

He said, you have to help me kill my parents.

Terrifying. I had to look at him one time, once, just to point him out and say that's who he is.

He told me that his wife had an accident and died. My very first thought was, That's a really weird coincidence and timing. And that really basically solves all his problems. But then I felt guilty about thinking that because he said it was an accident. And then the paper said it was an accident.

Right. But then he was very adamant about his innocence, always.

I answered all their questions and offered to give them a copy of the games, the Gregeman games that we played, so they'd have exact times that we played. Man, that was it. Did they tell you why they were there? They thought he was guilty. They said he was a really bad person and... I didn't believe them at the time. You had gotten to know him pretty well at this point, too. Right.

I never saw the monster that I eventually came to know until later.

He had a mercurial temper. It didn't take much to set him off.

One time during one of these fights, Rod had brought his arms back, and he shoved his father as hard as he could. His father went flying into the room, hit his head on the floor.

He said that because there was no electricity, the alarm would not be on. He wanted to go through a window in the basement, kill his parents, and set his house on fire. I was, you know, just stunned. He was going to— He wanted to go over there— Set fire? Kill his parents, set fire to the house, and somehow get Anna and Miles out safely.

And, you know, I discussed it with him for like 15 minutes or so. I'm like, no. You're not going to do this. And then finally I said, just how are you going to explain miraculously that you just happened to be there to save your children? And finally that, you know.

He finally backed down.

You wanted her to put rat poison in their food or sugar for their tea or whatever. Why don't you leave him at this point? How am I supposed to protect his parents if I don't know what he's plotting? You know, I can't be there and protect them. If I'm not there, he won't confide in me and let me know what's going on.

Either try and talk him out of it or have enough definitive proof where I can go to the police.

We were in the car driving, and he said to me, you have to help me kill my parents. And I said, I am not going to help you kill your parents. And he asked me like four or five times. And I finally, I just like, I'm not going to help you kill your parents. And even if I wanted to, which I don't, you'd kill me too. And he had this kind of creepy laugh.

And he looked at me in a way that, like, oh, you're just now figuring this out? And then he said, quote, no, I only want to kill the people who try to take my children away from me.

There was no question, susceptible of doubt in my mind that he killed her at that point.

No, I wasn't. I was mad at him.

Rod Copland calls 911 and says that his wife appears dead. He said that Anna found her in the bathtub.

Yes.

No.

No. I was mad at him. I was mad at him for a lot of reasons.

That is disgusting and false. That is not true.

It was like a huge weight has been lifted off of me, and I'm finally, like, completely relieved. You know, it's done. Do you regret the day you met Rod? I do. I really do.

He was adamant about his innocence. They just don't have direct evidence.

He was very charming, intelligent, funny in a quirky sort of way, and I really enjoyed playing backgammon with him.

Months later, their relationship became romantic. I wasn't looking for any sort of relationship. And he was pretty aggressive. And I think I was naive in the fact that I'm considerably older than Rod. So it never occurred to me that he would be interested in me in that way.

Right, and of course it made me feel good, you know, a younger man being attracted to me.