Dennis McKenna

So these non-psychedelic psychedelics, the thinking is, well, if you just tweak these receptors and you tweak these changes that the psychedelic produces without ever having

and experience it'll be fine you don't have to suffer all that terror all that trauma all that catharsis that you have to go through when you take a psychedelic therapy session you'll never know anything happened you'll just suddenly feel better you know This is bullshit, in my opinion. I think that you cannot dissociate the psychedelic experience from the therapeutic effect.

and experience it'll be fine you don't have to suffer all that terror all that trauma all that catharsis that you have to go through when you take a psychedelic therapy session you'll never know anything happened you'll just suddenly feel better you know This is bullshit, in my opinion. I think that you cannot dissociate the psychedelic experience from the therapeutic effect.

and experience it'll be fine you don't have to suffer all that terror all that trauma all that catharsis that you have to go through when you take a psychedelic therapy session you'll never know anything happened you'll just suddenly feel better you know This is bullshit, in my opinion. I think that you cannot dissociate the psychedelic experience from the therapeutic effect.

I think these people trying to develop non-psychedelic psychedelics are seriously deluded and misguided. And so psychedelics... have come back into medicine and it's changing the perception because in order to develop therapies that are appropriate to use psychedelics, they have to change their models, right? And drug development, drug approval, it's all so far been based on the

I think these people trying to develop non-psychedelic psychedelics are seriously deluded and misguided. And so psychedelics... have come back into medicine and it's changing the perception because in order to develop therapies that are appropriate to use psychedelics, they have to change their models, right? And drug development, drug approval, it's all so far been based on the

I think these people trying to develop non-psychedelic psychedelics are seriously deluded and misguided. And so psychedelics... have come back into medicine and it's changing the perception because in order to develop therapies that are appropriate to use psychedelics, they have to change their models, right? And drug development, drug approval, it's all so far been based on the

placebo-controlled double-blind clinical trial. That's the structure, right? And you know how that works. So you have a placebo, you have an active drug. The doctor and the patients don't know who's getting what until the blind is removed. And is there an effect? Or is it just placebo? Is there a real effect? And this is the approach they take to this thing.

placebo-controlled double-blind clinical trial. That's the structure, right? And you know how that works. So you have a placebo, you have an active drug. The doctor and the patients don't know who's getting what until the blind is removed. And is there an effect? Or is it just placebo? Is there a real effect? And this is the approach they take to this thing.

placebo-controlled double-blind clinical trial. That's the structure, right? And you know how that works. So you have a placebo, you have an active drug. The doctor and the patients don't know who's getting what until the blind is removed. And is there an effect? Or is it just placebo? Is there a real effect? And this is the approach they take to this thing.

When it comes to psychedelics, you cannot really apply that method. You can't develop a placebo controlled. How do you develop a placebo for something like psilocybin?

When it comes to psychedelics, you cannot really apply that method. You can't develop a placebo controlled. How do you develop a placebo for something like psilocybin?

When it comes to psychedelics, you cannot really apply that method. You can't develop a placebo controlled. How do you develop a placebo for something like psilocybin?

You know. I mean, the joke, the cartoon that you may have seen is, you know, they're in a clinic and, you know, half the people are dancing around and rolling on the floor and there's a couple sitting on the couch and he looks at the woman and he says, I'm guessing we got the placebo. Yeah, right, yes. And this is true.

You know. I mean, the joke, the cartoon that you may have seen is, you know, they're in a clinic and, you know, half the people are dancing around and rolling on the floor and there's a couple sitting on the couch and he looks at the woman and he says, I'm guessing we got the placebo. Yeah, right, yes. And this is true.

You know. I mean, the joke, the cartoon that you may have seen is, you know, they're in a clinic and, you know, half the people are dancing around and rolling on the floor and there's a couple sitting on the couch and he looks at the woman and he says, I'm guessing we got the placebo. Yeah, right, yes. And this is true.

And, you know, and this is important because... Because if they insist on developing these drugs using these outmoded methodologies based on placebo-controlled clinical trials, they can't do it. MDMA went down in flames for exactly this reason.

And, you know, and this is important because... Because if they insist on developing these drugs using these outmoded methodologies based on placebo-controlled clinical trials, they can't do it. MDMA went down in flames for exactly this reason.

And, you know, and this is important because... Because if they insist on developing these drugs using these outmoded methodologies based on placebo-controlled clinical trials, they can't do it. MDMA went down in flames for exactly this reason.

The company that MAPS formed, Lycos, to bring MDMA to the market had like $50 million involved in this, and they did clinical trials with MDMA for trauma, and it was very effective. But there was an FDA review board. Most of the people on the board were not really clinicians. None of them had any experience themselves with any of these psychedelics or any really clinical trials.