Dr. Adam Posen

And on the other hand, that economic choices are being made on a commercial basis.

and that's why no matter how many times people of different parties and different administrations or appointments fail on this front you want to have a system of scrutiny and rules and presumptions that discourages our elected officials from being so overt about it i think

to be fair, you know, the Trump administration and the sons of President Trump and Secretary Ludnick and the Middle East negotiator guy and all these people, you know, they're being very open.

And I think that in one sense, does matter, like they are with crypto.

But in another sense, that doesn't solve the problem, because then the perception is still

People are being favored, decisions are being made on a bad basis.

You have to offer gold crowns or hotel deals to make things happen.

It's bad, but it's not the end of the world.

Oh, I think they're enormous.

I think then because it's the US, which as I've argued, Tim, has been the linchpin of the rules-based, law-based system of economies since World War II, it has repercussions around the world because it means the US is not only enforcing the norms against this kind of corruption or perceived corruption or tied political choice-making,

um it means that the u.s is is setting an example that you can get away with it and other people should get away with it and it breaks down the regimes and the operating principles we have to deter these things so when i say it's not the end of the world i don't mean to suggest it's not very harmful it will reduce the returns on capital it will reduce the ability of average people and normal businesses to get access to opportunities

It will divide the world.

It will increase instability in investment markets.

It will waste public money.

It's bad in a lot of ways.

I just merely want to be very clear that though it's unusual for the U.S.

in the last 100 plus years to behave this way in our long ago history and in other countries around the world, this has taken place and that there have been much smaller, much less overt examples of this.

by previous US administrations.

And you're asking very profound questions.

I'll just say that in an enlightened administration, the reason you get involved in the rest of the world is because it ultimately is to if you set up a rest of the world that feels safer and less corrupt and more stable and less subject to disease and refugee flows and wars, that's ultimately to the benefit of the average American.