Dr. Alan O'Sullivan

And perhaps its economic dominance is also waning.

How does this play out, let's say, over the next couple of years?

That's a big question.

the whole mutual destruction piece that we're hearing about far too frequently at the moment.

But just back to the point regarding strategy and policy.

I mean, there's obviously the European leaders have left Europe in a really vulnerable position.

This was highlighted during COVID with energy and then highlighted most recently with security.

We heard JD Vance's comments in Munich

When we think about rolling back the clock a bit, Matt, and looking at, was there a failure by the West, i.e.

Europe, US, to integrate the Russians, let's say?

And let's call a spade a spade.

Stop.

Stop expanding into territory as aggressively as they were.

I mean, you don't hear that too often in Western media, but it's something that has to be recognized.

You poke the Russian bear continuously, you're going to get a reaction.

It was a famous speech by Putin, sorry if I interrupt, a famous speech I think in 2005 where John McCain is and Putin and Putin gave this really shocking speech where he said, you are encroaching, we have warned you.

And this is just four years after 9-11 where I think Putin was the first phone call to Bush.

It's amazing how quickly, in terms of alliances, it's amazing how quickly it all unraveled.

Very good, very good.

I like the analogy.