Dr. John Bergsma

And so she had that.

So I think it's actually, thematic conception is like, in terms of its complexity as a doctrine, it's really rather simple, I think.

Now, as to the question of attesting to it in tradition and so on.

In scripture?

and in scripture, you know, I think that the fundamental, you know, we see indications of Mary's holiness in scripture, like for example, the absolutely singular way that she's greeted at the Annunciation.

you know, called by the angel, by a Greek participle, meaning she who has been graced, you know, which we traditionally translate as full of grace.

Nobody's addressed like that in salvation history.

And am I right in thinking the angel calls her?

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, you got it.

No, I think it is.

Simon changed to Peter to be called full of grace.

Right.

Who is referred to by this way?

So what I would say is the central teaching about Mary is that

she is singularly holy in a unique way.

We can see that from the scriptures, but then it becomes a question of definition.

Like, okay, well, how holy?

Does that holiness extend to her birth?

Does it go back even farther?