Ezra Klein

But if they're playing mass and multiplayer online games all the time and they enjoy it and their grades are fine, what are you really going to say? Right. And somewhere in this, some texture is lost. Like I think that I associate more with classical education or something. But we're trying to develop certain facilities that are part of being a human being.

But if they're playing mass and multiplayer online games all the time and they enjoy it and their grades are fine, what are you really going to say? Right. And somewhere in this, some texture is lost. Like I think that I associate more with classical education or something. But we're trying to develop certain facilities that are part of being a human being.

I always think about attention as one of them. What kind of attention? We hear all this concern now that kids are graduated in high school. Even kids going to good colleges can't read a full book. Can't read a book. Can't watch a movie. But there's more than that. I think we care about if our children are nice or kind. We sort of have that.

I always think about attention as one of them. What kind of attention? We hear all this concern now that kids are graduated in high school. Even kids going to good colleges can't read a full book. Can't read a book. Can't watch a movie. But there's more than that. I think we care about if our children are nice or kind. We sort of have that.

But there's a lot about all kinds of virtues that we've just lost the way to talk about and that we're not comfortable saying. I mean, I see it with parents all the time. You need some great reason to say the kid shouldn't be on the iPad. And maybe it's that you think their grades will be bad or their anxiety will be high.

But there's a lot about all kinds of virtues that we've just lost the way to talk about and that we're not comfortable saying. I mean, I see it with parents all the time. You need some great reason to say the kid shouldn't be on the iPad. And maybe it's that you think their grades will be bad or their anxiety will be high.

But you can't just say like nobody feels that comfortable saying it's just bad. I just don't want you looking at the screen all the time. I think it's bad. I think it's not the way to be a human being. That's right.

But you can't just say like nobody feels that comfortable saying it's just bad. I just don't want you looking at the screen all the time. I think it's bad. I think it's not the way to be a human being. That's right.

So that's what I'd like you to talk a bit about. You have one chapter on this in the book. It's a little shorter. It's about spirituality. But your first book is all about moral frameworks. Mm-hmm. Connect these for me because I do, we lost paternalism. Like, I do think parenting lost an idea that it is confident about. Yeah. About what we are trying to raise people towards.

So that's what I'd like you to talk a bit about. You have one chapter on this in the book. It's a little shorter. It's about spirituality. But your first book is all about moral frameworks. Mm-hmm. Connect these for me because I do, we lost paternalism. Like, I do think parenting lost an idea that it is confident about. Yeah. About what we are trying to raise people towards.

There's no moral order. I think it was you. I was listening to a conversation with you some years ago. And you said something like, it is just bad. For teenage girls to be endlessly posting pictures of themselves on the Internet for other people to rate right through.

There's no moral order. I think it was you. I was listening to a conversation with you some years ago. And you said something like, it is just bad. For teenage girls to be endlessly posting pictures of themselves on the Internet for other people to rate right through.

And I I remember thinking that's so unbelievably fucking obvious. And so much not how we actually just talk about it, right? Because what you're making there was fundamentally immoral judgment. I know behind it, there's evidence. But I do find that within the conversation about social media and the way we're constructing childhood, there is this demand to bring the studies, right?

And I I remember thinking that's so unbelievably fucking obvious. And so much not how we actually just talk about it, right? Because what you're making there was fundamentally immoral judgment. I know behind it, there's evidence. But I do find that within the conversation about social media and the way we're constructing childhood, there is this demand to bring the studies, right?

And I've said this before. I think if you could prove to me That it doesn't matter at all for anxiety at 16 or earnings at 23, whether or not kids spend 2.5 hours or three hours a day on TikTok. I think it would change my view of whether they should do that 0%. Okay. Because I just think it's a bad way to live. Mm-hmm. And it's a bad way to live for other reasons, right?

And I've said this before. I think if you could prove to me That it doesn't matter at all for anxiety at 16 or earnings at 23, whether or not kids spend 2.5 hours or three hours a day on TikTok. I think it would change my view of whether they should do that 0%. Okay. Because I just think it's a bad way to live. Mm-hmm. And it's a bad way to live for other reasons, right?

I think it'll create, by nature, it creates self-obsession, right? By nature, it creates this management of the personal brand. And even if I couldn't find correlates there of bad outcomes, I have a view on what it means to be like a flourishing human being that should not include too much of that, right? That wants to keep that boxed up a little bit in the human psyche, right?

I think it'll create, by nature, it creates self-obsession, right? By nature, it creates this management of the personal brand. And even if I couldn't find correlates there of bad outcomes, I have a view on what it means to be like a flourishing human being that should not include too much of that, right? That wants to keep that boxed up a little bit in the human psyche, right?

And this is where things feel like they ran aground to me in a lot of the debates. I feel like parenting and the culture parents come from now, unless you are in some form of church, basically, is incredibly insecure about making these judgments. That's right. I don't fully understand why. I don't think it is just a loss of trust thing. Yeah.

And this is where things feel like they ran aground to me in a lot of the debates. I feel like parenting and the culture parents come from now, unless you are in some form of church, basically, is incredibly insecure about making these judgments. That's right. I don't fully understand why. I don't think it is just a loss of trust thing. Yeah.