Hannah Rosen

I mean, I'm reading in the lines of what you're saying. So we don't know the degree of mistrust yet. It's probably brewing. But it sounds like from what you're saying, it makes everybody less safe. Like it makes us less safe, too, because these are how, you know, terrorist threats are detected and these networks are very intertwined. So it feels a little precarious, dangerous.

So what else are people bringing up? You mentioned that makes them nervous. You mentioned, you know, Trump has leaked secrets before. Like I think he famously tweet a top secret image of an Iranian rocket launch site. I mean, he's known for being a little lax with other people's intelligence. So that's one thing. Is that on people's minds?

So what else are people bringing up? You mentioned that makes them nervous. You mentioned, you know, Trump has leaked secrets before. Like I think he famously tweet a top secret image of an Iranian rocket launch site. I mean, he's known for being a little lax with other people's intelligence. So that's one thing. Is that on people's minds?

So what else are people bringing up? You mentioned that makes them nervous. You mentioned, you know, Trump has leaked secrets before. Like I think he famously tweet a top secret image of an Iranian rocket launch site. I mean, he's known for being a little lax with other people's intelligence. So that's one thing. Is that on people's minds?

Right. You know, some leaders in Europe have talked about, like Emmanuel Macron hinted at this in his meeting with Trump, that actually being less dependent on the US for their security might be a good thing for Europe. I wonder if there's a version of that for intelligence, like we don't want to be as dependent on the US.

Right. You know, some leaders in Europe have talked about, like Emmanuel Macron hinted at this in his meeting with Trump, that actually being less dependent on the US for their security might be a good thing for Europe. I wonder if there's a version of that for intelligence, like we don't want to be as dependent on the US.

Right. You know, some leaders in Europe have talked about, like Emmanuel Macron hinted at this in his meeting with Trump, that actually being less dependent on the US for their security might be a good thing for Europe. I wonder if there's a version of that for intelligence, like we don't want to be as dependent on the US.

There's some advantage to switching up the way that we've been doing things.

There's some advantage to switching up the way that we've been doing things.

There's some advantage to switching up the way that we've been doing things.

Yeah, and that's, I suppose, value neutral? Like, we don't know if that's a good or a bad thing?

Yeah, and that's, I suppose, value neutral? Like, we don't know if that's a good or a bad thing?

Yeah, and that's, I suppose, value neutral? Like, we don't know if that's a good or a bad thing?

A last thing. I mean, I'm thinking about Trump signaling his closeness with Vladimir Putin, you know, how he recently repeated some Russian talking points. I wonder how those kinds of signals get received among the people you talk to, intelligence officials, sort of people who are guarding these alliances. What's the result of those kinds of actions?

A last thing. I mean, I'm thinking about Trump signaling his closeness with Vladimir Putin, you know, how he recently repeated some Russian talking points. I wonder how those kinds of signals get received among the people you talk to, intelligence officials, sort of people who are guarding these alliances. What's the result of those kinds of actions?

A last thing. I mean, I'm thinking about Trump signaling his closeness with Vladimir Putin, you know, how he recently repeated some Russian talking points. I wonder how those kinds of signals get received among the people you talk to, intelligence officials, sort of people who are guarding these alliances. What's the result of those kinds of actions?

I see. So this erosion of trust is long and slow. And what's been shocking to the rest of us, the intelligence community has been monitoring for a while, those who are keeping close tabs.

I see. So this erosion of trust is long and slow. And what's been shocking to the rest of us, the intelligence community has been monitoring for a while, those who are keeping close tabs.

I see. So this erosion of trust is long and slow. And what's been shocking to the rest of us, the intelligence community has been monitoring for a while, those who are keeping close tabs.

Well, Shane, thank you so much for joining us today. You always teach us so much about worlds that we don't know a lot about.