James Kirby

private credit, which has always been there.

It just happens to be booming at the moment, backing, you know, property developers nine times out of 10.

Let's just talk about the global stuff that we know of so far in terms of exposures to it and links with it.

Koda Capital, K-O-D-A Capital.

I dealt with that.

I talked to them during the week.

They have about 200 million linked with Blue Owl.

And they...

Well, they would be watching it very carefully.

In particular, they have a thing called the Blue Owl Credit Income Fund, which is a fund which is linked with the fund in the US.

Crucially, folks, make the point that though it's gated in the US, Andy was explaining what gated is, only 5% of units can be withdrawn at any given time, which is kind of partially freezing.

The Australian fund is not gated, the Blue Owl Credit Income Fund.

And also, Andy, one of the big super funds, NGS Superfund, also has about 200 million on the books relating to Blue Owl.

It's one of their investment managers.

Is this just the tip of the iceberg?

Which would you prefer, to be in a big super fund...

knowing that they have exposure to private credit, or to be an investor, what they say, a self-managed super fund, an active investor who went through a wealth manager and has taken an investment in a private credit fund, which would you prefer to be?

Sorry, institutional investors, is it?

Yes, well, I mean, to be fair to the wealth boutiques out there, and we all know who the

felt they must provide this.