Jason Marzak

Maduro doesn't have that money and has focused even more so on the repression.

venezuela historically had a very strong economy now the economy right now 500 inflation is hard to actually get the right the real numbers 90 people below the poverty line uh we crunched some numbers here at the atlantic council the other day they would say you continue the the policies uh of of uh of chavismo and it would take until the 2070s for the venezuelan economy to recover it's just a

a sign of how bad things have become.

And that economy is one that's going to require the oil industry to be revived, but not just for the industry to be revived, but also for those profits to actually flow back to the Venezuelan people rather than to the military or to the regime to keep them in line with the current government's policies.

The economy will be incredibly difficult, as I mentioned previously, to resurrect.

This is going to be one of the most complicated restructurings of economy that we have seen – frankly, that we've seen in the Western Hemisphere and one of the most complicated that we'll probably have seen on a global level because not just do you have the economic challenges that we've discussed –

But there's also going to be a need for restructuring of the sovereign debt.

There are a number of different cases of international arbitration.

How do those holders of Venezuelan debt become satisfied with payments?

And so it's going to be very difficult for Venezuela to kind of re-enter international markets without all the complicated

that are owed by Venezuela to the international community being satisfied as well.

Well, I think that the – I don't think the United States is trying to colonize the country.

I think the United States is using its leverage to push for changes within the regime and those changes are beginning with stabilization but will also – a political transition and Secretary –

Rubio mentioned this as well, the importance of a political transition as well.

It's very difficult to know the exact sentiment of the Venezuelan people because only those who oppose the U.S.

can go out into the streets and protest or celebrate without risk of being thrown into Venezuelan jails.

Yeah, so...

Under Hugo Chavez, Venezuela at a time of more riches for Venezuela, it used its oil to be able to exact political favors and political partnerships from Caribbean countries but other countries around the world as well.

I would say the detriment of the Venezuelan people because that money that was being sold – the oil that was being sold was not money going back to the Venezuelan people.

Now, the ability of the Venezuelans to use oil for that type of political leverage has significantly waned if not –