Jeff Goldenberg

So I really do believe in that.

I wish my 20-year-old self knew that there was all this stuff.

And of course, a lot of this wasn't available back then.

But this concept that you don't have to go all in on a concept right from the beginning.

You could kick the tires.

You could MVP it.

You could get a whole bunch of amazing feedback early instead of spending the multi-millions and six to 12 months building something and then finding out later on that it's not perfect or it's not exact.

or it hits someone's number two need and not their number one need that they're willing to pay money for.

I wish back then I knew that you could sort of test and bring a product along more through like a lean and iterative process than just saying, okay, I'm putting $2 million in a year of my life into it and then finding out whether people want it or not.

Hey, thank you so much for having me.

It's been great.

You bet.