Jeremy Corbell

And it was from the religious element I ultimately found out.

They found out about this program by people talking about those secure phones.

They weren't concerned about this was leaking.

They were concerned that this project even existed.

Were those people beaten back?

Well, they didn't think they were, but they were.

They were.

And they were beaten back in three different organizations.

In fact, one, I believe, one of the proponents was thrown out of the room, literally.

So it was... I'm giving you a story in one sense about the experience that I had at DIA and with DHS and with DNI.

It was a pitched battle.

I mean, there were people at DHS that...

I was warned, you need to keep clear of them.

I didn't even work there and I'm being warned by who did.

You know, they're in a, they've got the management a year and I'm talking top level, the directors a year.

And, you know,

Don't engage with them.

Don't say the slightest word wrong.

It was just unbelievable.

In fact, it's a story both of you would love to hear.