Jessica Badalana

Wow.

But you're totally right that cookies have become very extra. Like they are frosted. They have tahini in them. The butter is brown. They're giant. They have like huge pools of chocolate. Like they have more chocolate than they do batter. Lots of innovation happening. Some good.

But you're totally right that cookies have become very extra. Like they are frosted. They have tahini in them. The butter is brown. They're giant. They have like huge pools of chocolate. Like they have more chocolate than they do batter. Lots of innovation happening. Some good.

some less good, but there's also been this like absolutely like explosive growth of these cookie chains in the last few years. And I think those cookie chains of which there are now numerous ones, they're sort of resetting chocolate chip cookie expectations because these chains are now everywhere, they're beloved and they're creating a new standard and that standard I think is big.

some less good, but there's also been this like absolutely like explosive growth of these cookie chains in the last few years. And I think those cookie chains of which there are now numerous ones, they're sort of resetting chocolate chip cookie expectations because these chains are now everywhere, they're beloved and they're creating a new standard and that standard I think is big.

Super sweet cookies.

Super sweet cookies.

And these chains have been so hugely successful. Crumble started with one store in Utah back in 2017, and now there are over 1,000 franchise-owned Crumble stores in the U.S., 18 in Canada, 96% of which have opened since 2020. So it's not our imagination that in the last...

And these chains have been so hugely successful. Crumble started with one store in Utah back in 2017, and now there are over 1,000 franchise-owned Crumble stores in the U.S., 18 in Canada, 96% of which have opened since 2020. So it's not our imagination that in the last...

four years like it's been it's been crazy cookie time and those chains have generated more than a billion dollars in sales and sold 300 million cookies and you know sorry not sorry that's a lot of dough david that's a lot of cookie dough okay well the point is chocolate chip cookies never go out of fashion people never get bored with them and they're here to stay

four years like it's been it's been crazy cookie time and those chains have generated more than a billion dollars in sales and sold 300 million cookies and you know sorry not sorry that's a lot of dough david that's a lot of cookie dough okay well the point is chocolate chip cookies never go out of fashion people never get bored with them and they're here to stay

Every episode we'll be chatting with the best bakers around. And recently I was reading best-selling cookbook author and TV host Zoe Francois' latest book, Zoe Bakes Cookies. As you might expect, it is an exhaustive and extensively researched guide to cookie baking. And part of what makes it so amazing is the deep dive that Zoe takes in every element of chocolate chip cookies.

Every episode we'll be chatting with the best bakers around. And recently I was reading best-selling cookbook author and TV host Zoe Francois' latest book, Zoe Bakes Cookies. As you might expect, it is an exhaustive and extensively researched guide to cookie baking. And part of what makes it so amazing is the deep dive that Zoe takes in every element of chocolate chip cookies.

With photos and charts, you can really sort of drill down into what a simple tweak or a seemingly simple tweak to a recipe does to the end result. So we decided to call up Zoe to talk more about chocolate chip cookies and get some of her secrets.

With photos and charts, you can really sort of drill down into what a simple tweak or a seemingly simple tweak to a recipe does to the end result. So we decided to call up Zoe to talk more about chocolate chip cookies and get some of her secrets.

Zoe, did you already have those family recipes before you started writing your book?

Zoe, did you already have those family recipes before you started writing your book?

In the book, you talk a lot about what happens if you alter one ingredient in your chocolate chip cookie dough, like if you use brown sugar instead of granulated sugar, or you swap shortening for some of the butter, or use less flour or more baking powder.

In the book, you talk a lot about what happens if you alter one ingredient in your chocolate chip cookie dough, like if you use brown sugar instead of granulated sugar, or you swap shortening for some of the butter, or use less flour or more baking powder.

And I'm just sort of curious what it must have been like when you were testing all those variations, because I imagine it was kind of an intense process.