Joe Carlsmith

I don't think that makes it insignificant though.

Like suppose you show up in the future and it's like, it's got some answer to the Riemann hypothesis, right?

And you can't tell whether that answer's right.

Maybe the civilization went wrong.

It's still an important difference, right?

It's just that you can't track it.

And I think something similar is true of worlds that are genuinely expressive of what we would value if we engaged in processes of reflection that we endorse versus ones that have kind of totally

veered off into something meaningless.

Yeah, so I agree.

I mean, I think there's a few different things there, right?

So there's kind of, what are you going for?

You're going for like actively good, you're going for avoiding certain stuff, right?

And then there's a different question, which is what counts as actively good according to you?

So maybe some people are like, the only things that are actively good are like,

my grandchildren or, or I don't know, like some like literal descending genetic line from me or something.

I'm like, well, that sounds, that's not, that's not my thing.

Um, and, uh, and I don't think it's really what most people have in mind when they talk about goodness.

I mean, I mean, I think there's a conversation to be had like a, and obviously in some sense, when we talk about a good future, we need to be thinking about like, what are all the stakeholders here and how, how does it all fit together?

Um, uh, but I think,

Yeah.