Joe Leahy

Yeah, exactly.

That was one of the first things I noticed.

I used to go to China in the 90s and then the 2000s.

And it was always very noisy with trucks and motorbikes like any city.

And now it's just strangely quiet.

It's kind of almost surreal.

Well, I think the states don't need to be bothered because they already got de-industrialized by China shock 1.0.

But I think the interesting thing is, you know, China, since they came out with this plan made in China 2025 in 2015, and they targeted all of these sectors from shipbuilding, trains, supercomputers, everything.

And they're sort of gradually meeting those targets.

And now, square in their sights, all of the industries that Europe traditionally has been very good at.

Yeah, the Southeast Asia case is particularly interesting because these are developing economies that had hoped to continue down the path of industrial progress, but China's essentially doing everything.

It's doing everything from textiles and shoes all the way to EV exports, power machinery, everything.

So there's really nothing left for these countries to do, and they're losing jobs.

If it is the case, Joe, that China...

is focusing on high value, but subsidized and state mandated production.

And along with those EVs and machine tools, it is exporting to the rest of the world.

It's essentially exporting unemployment to the rest of the world.

Why doesn't this end in a terrible political conflict?

In other words, can China expect the rest of the world to stand for this industrial policy?

I mean, that's a great point, Robert.