Joe Lonsdale

And PayPal and its competitors were going under thanks to this. And so we had to figure out at PayPal How do you go after it? We actually ended up taking a bunch of our customer service people, building these tools for them, building investigative tools, and then helping them figure out how to stop and catch some of the bad guys and then turn them into Secret Service and FBI.

And PayPal and its competitors were going under thanks to this. And so we had to figure out at PayPal How do you go after it? We actually ended up taking a bunch of our customer service people, building these tools for them, building investigative tools, and then helping them figure out how to stop and catch some of the bad guys and then turn them into Secret Service and FBI.

So I ended up getting to know a bunch of these Secret Service and FBI guys around 2001, 2002.

So I ended up getting to know a bunch of these Secret Service and FBI guys around 2001, 2002.

So I ended up getting to know a bunch of these Secret Service and FBI guys around 2001, 2002.

It was kind of a cat and mouse game because every time you'd figure out what the bad guys were doing, they'd change their method. So we tried to use AI. It wasn't nearly as good 20 years ago. The AI could detect some things, but you really needed the human intelligence layers. You'd have a machine learning layer and you'd have these tools to let people see what was going on.

It was kind of a cat and mouse game because every time you'd figure out what the bad guys were doing, they'd change their method. So we tried to use AI. It wasn't nearly as good 20 years ago. The AI could detect some things, but you really needed the human intelligence layers. You'd have a machine learning layer and you'd have these tools to let people see what was going on.

It was kind of a cat and mouse game because every time you'd figure out what the bad guys were doing, they'd change their method. So we tried to use AI. It wasn't nearly as good 20 years ago. The AI could detect some things, but you really needed the human intelligence layers. You'd have a machine learning layer and you'd have these tools to let people see what was going on.

And you'd keep just iterating, staying ahead of them. And the tools were good enough. We cut down the fraud by about 90%. And that made it profitable. And then PayPal was sold to eBay. And so the anti-fraud thing was a big piece of what made PayPal work. And we got to know these Secret Service guys. And these are good guys. A lot of them are good old boys. They're not tech guys.

And you'd keep just iterating, staying ahead of them. And the tools were good enough. We cut down the fraud by about 90%. And that made it profitable. And then PayPal was sold to eBay. And so the anti-fraud thing was a big piece of what made PayPal work. And we got to know these Secret Service guys. And these are good guys. A lot of them are good old boys. They're not tech guys.

And you'd keep just iterating, staying ahead of them. And the tools were good enough. We cut down the fraud by about 90%. And that made it profitable. And then PayPal was sold to eBay. And so the anti-fraud thing was a big piece of what made PayPal work. And we got to know these Secret Service guys. And these are good guys. A lot of them are good old boys. They're not tech guys.

They're just trying to figure out what the heck this internet thing is and how to deal with it and how to catch the bad guys. And so they'd come to us for advice. And I got to know quite a few of them. And they'd come to me for advice on other stuff. And we started chatting with them, because cybercrime was a new thing, and you're helping them out.

They're just trying to figure out what the heck this internet thing is and how to deal with it and how to catch the bad guys. And so they'd come to us for advice. And I got to know quite a few of them. And they'd come to me for advice on other stuff. And we started chatting with them, because cybercrime was a new thing, and you're helping them out.

They're just trying to figure out what the heck this internet thing is and how to deal with it and how to catch the bad guys. And so they'd come to us for advice. And I got to know quite a few of them. And they'd come to me for advice on other stuff. And we started chatting with them, because cybercrime was a new thing, and you're helping them out.

And then 9-11 happened, and then we kind of saw the government spend billions of dollars trying to build new tools to help them do better, stop future stuff. And the stuff they were building horrified us. It was stuff that was based on principles from maybe like 20 years ago. And we're like, wait a second, guys. Silicon Valley exists. We've done all these new things with all the top talent.

And then 9-11 happened, and then we kind of saw the government spend billions of dollars trying to build new tools to help them do better, stop future stuff. And the stuff they were building horrified us. It was stuff that was based on principles from maybe like 20 years ago. And we're like, wait a second, guys. Silicon Valley exists. We've done all these new things with all the top talent.

And then 9-11 happened, and then we kind of saw the government spend billions of dollars trying to build new tools to help them do better, stop future stuff. And the stuff they were building horrified us. It was stuff that was based on principles from maybe like 20 years ago. And we're like, wait a second, guys. Silicon Valley exists. We've done all these new things with all the top talent.

And it was just so disconnecting. We realized this is actually really scary, because our country's spending... actually tens of billions of dollars on this stuff that doesn't work, that's 20 years out of date. It's just completely not what a top software culture is. And that's when we realized, well, we've got to figure out how to get involved and how to fix this. And how did you get involved?

And it was just so disconnecting. We realized this is actually really scary, because our country's spending... actually tens of billions of dollars on this stuff that doesn't work, that's 20 years out of date. It's just completely not what a top software culture is. And that's when we realized, well, we've got to figure out how to get involved and how to fix this. And how did you get involved?

And it was just so disconnecting. We realized this is actually really scary, because our country's spending... actually tens of billions of dollars on this stuff that doesn't work, that's 20 years out of date. It's just completely not what a top software culture is. And that's when we realized, well, we've got to figure out how to get involved and how to fix this. And how did you get involved?