John Burn-Murdoch

So one is that everything you're describing here relies on having an enormous amount of data to feed into the models, both when you're training them and then when you're using them.

When people raise concerns about the amount of data that needs to be stored there digitally and the risk of security issues, you know, we had the UK biobank leak recently.

How do you think or how do you suggest people should think about the trade-offs involved there?

Because again, there's a lot of discussion here about the risks of having it all in one place and people are concerned about specifically the US tech company Palantir's role here.

What do other countries that do this well do?

Because I guess the specific concern that's been raised with Palantir is that almost by necessity, by definition, you have to give US software engineers unlimited access to this data.

That's something that's been confirmed by reporting by the Financial Times, for example.

So even if there is not an intent to go in there and fiddle with things,

There is exposure there, there is risk.

Are you basically saying that that is unavoidable unless we have a British Palantir equivalent that can keep everything, access, the entire thing onshore?

Yeah, so there are many, many, many multifaceted things going into this.

And I should just interject at this point and add NHS England's statement on Palantir is that the NHS has strict policies in place for managing access to patient data and carries out regular audits to ensure compliance, including monitoring the work of engineers, helping to set up the central data collection platform that will track NHS performance and help improve care for patients.

Anyone external requiring access must have government security clearance and be approved by a member of NHS England staff at director level or above.

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And now, back to Sir John.

It strikes me that a lot of these technologies and solutions have been generated to a large extent on the back of US financing, that a lot of medical innovation comes out of America.

But in the last year to 18 months under Donald Trump's second term, we've seen the US pull out of the WHO, we've seen under RFK Jr.

as well this...

withdrawal or canceling of investment in mRNA vaccines, which we talked about the importance of earlier.

How do you view what we're seeing here in terms of the, we're really seeing revealed the vulnerability or reliance of a lot of this stuff on the US.