John Lechner

They have state backing, but Pergosian is also out there with his guys basically doing business development, right? If you have a PMC, where are you going to market your services? You have to go to Africa at some point. Otherwise, you should fire your B&D guy. And so already in 2017, Progozhin is sending his guys out to drum up new business.

They have state backing, but Pergosian is also out there with his guys basically doing business development, right? If you have a PMC, where are you going to market your services? You have to go to Africa at some point. Otherwise, you should fire your B&D guy. And so already in 2017, Progozhin is sending his guys out to drum up new business.

They have state backing, but Pergosian is also out there with his guys basically doing business development, right? If you have a PMC, where are you going to market your services? You have to go to Africa at some point. Otherwise, you should fire your B&D guy. And so already in 2017, Progozhin is sending his guys out to drum up new business.

They first sign a contract with the Sudanese to provide training and they get access to mining concessions in Sudan. Then they show up in the Central African Republic where There's really no other kind of competition from other Russians. And so Progozhin is able to provide training.

They first sign a contract with the Sudanese to provide training and they get access to mining concessions in Sudan. Then they show up in the Central African Republic where There's really no other kind of competition from other Russians. And so Progozhin is able to provide training.

They first sign a contract with the Sudanese to provide training and they get access to mining concessions in Sudan. Then they show up in the Central African Republic where There's really no other kind of competition from other Russians. And so Progozhin is able to provide training.

He offers his like information warfare because he has the troll farms, which were kind of very famous in the US during the 2016 elections. And his guys go out and they try to start breweries and they go into gold mining and what have you. They act, as Murat was saying, very independently of the Kremlin because... These places aren't that important to Russia.

He offers his like information warfare because he has the troll farms, which were kind of very famous in the US during the 2016 elections. And his guys go out and they try to start breweries and they go into gold mining and what have you. They act, as Murat was saying, very independently of the Kremlin because... These places aren't that important to Russia.

He offers his like information warfare because he has the troll farms, which were kind of very famous in the US during the 2016 elections. And his guys go out and they try to start breweries and they go into gold mining and what have you. They act, as Murat was saying, very independently of the Kremlin because... These places aren't that important to Russia.

And so in the places that aren't important, he has to figure out his own ways to finance these operations. And so they go from the Central African Republic, they're in Libya, back in Haftar in his bid to take Tripoli in 2019. Then they show up in Mali, where they sign a deal with the Malian government to go after various jihadi groups.

And so in the places that aren't important, he has to figure out his own ways to finance these operations. And so they go from the Central African Republic, they're in Libya, back in Haftar in his bid to take Tripoli in 2019. Then they show up in Mali, where they sign a deal with the Malian government to go after various jihadi groups.

And so in the places that aren't important, he has to figure out his own ways to finance these operations. And so they go from the Central African Republic, they're in Libya, back in Haftar in his bid to take Tripoli in 2019. Then they show up in Mali, where they sign a deal with the Malian government to go after various jihadi groups.

And then ultimately, they are initially left out of the full-scale invasion of Ukraine in February 2022 and only get brought in when the Russian government's in trouble.

And then ultimately, they are initially left out of the full-scale invasion of Ukraine in February 2022 and only get brought in when the Russian government's in trouble.

And then ultimately, they are initially left out of the full-scale invasion of Ukraine in February 2022 and only get brought in when the Russian government's in trouble.

Yeah, but I think that it's not... Because people always ask, you know, is this a private thing or a public thing? And the answer is both. And I mean, we're in Paris right now, but when I'm sitting in Washington, D.C., I try to explain to people, like, this is the capital of public-private partnerships, right? Lockheed Martin is a profit-driven company.

Yeah, but I think that it's not... Because people always ask, you know, is this a private thing or a public thing? And the answer is both. And I mean, we're in Paris right now, but when I'm sitting in Washington, D.C., I try to explain to people, like, this is the capital of public-private partnerships, right? Lockheed Martin is a profit-driven company.

Yeah, but I think that it's not... Because people always ask, you know, is this a private thing or a public thing? And the answer is both. And I mean, we're in Paris right now, but when I'm sitting in Washington, D.C., I try to explain to people, like, this is the capital of public-private partnerships, right? Lockheed Martin is a profit-driven company.

They will frame whatever they're doing as furthering America's national defense and security, but they're also profit-driven. And so what Prigozhin was very good at was selling back to the Kremlin this dream of kind of Russia's expansion abroad. And he could sell it back to Putin, these different initiatives that were also just happened to be, you know, potentially profitable to him.

They will frame whatever they're doing as furthering America's national defense and security, but they're also profit-driven. And so what Prigozhin was very good at was selling back to the Kremlin this dream of kind of Russia's expansion abroad. And he could sell it back to Putin, these different initiatives that were also just happened to be, you know, potentially profitable to him.