Jonathan Rauch

And that people need these labels.

They need these boxes to put things in, in order to be able to keep their eye on the bigger picture.

And that fascism is now the appropriate box.

And in fact, maybe the only appropriate box.

So that's why I thought this was important.

Others may think it's premature.

I don't know.

The first thing I should say, if I can have a word of preface, is that there is no bright line settled definition of fascism.

Even fascists don't agree on what fascism is.

And in different countries over many years, it's taken different forms.

Japan looked very different from Franco, who looked different from Mussolini, who looked different from Hitler.

So my method here was to assemble characteristics

that most people would agree are, first of all, consonant with fascism, and second of all, dissonant with, incompatible with liberal pluralism.

And I think everything on this list fits that bill and everything on this list fits Trump and the direction he's trying to take the country.

It does not fit the country as a whole.

We'll come back to that.

But we don't live in a fascist state.

We live in a mixed state, hybrid state, with a liberal constitution and a fascist leader.

That gets complicated.

Okay.