Juana Summers

Can you guess who President Trump is talking about here?

That is the president in 2017 praising Jerome Powell, his nominee for Federal Reserve chairman.

What does Trump say about Powell these days?

Well, here he is last November at an investment event.

It's a little different.

After their friendly start, the chairman and president had a rocky relationship during Trump's first term.

Things got worse as the COVID-19 pandemic wreaked havoc on the economy and inflation skyrocketed.

In 2024, when Trump ran for re-election, he said he wouldn't appoint Powell for another 10-year term.

And things have only gotten worse since Trump was sworn in last January.

He's called Powell a political hack, among other things.

And the president has tried to strong-arm Powell into drastically cutting interest rates.

Trump has also closely scrutinized building reservations the Fed authorized that went over budget.

Through it all, Powell has stayed mostly measured and diplomatic.

Take the summer when President Trump toured Federal Reserve buildings being renovated and seemed to be building a case to fire Powell over those renovations' cost overruns.

Over the weekend, that changed.

NPR chief economics correspondent Scott Horsley explained it on our sister podcast up first.

The subpoenas prompted Powell to release an uncharacteristically strong statement.

Trump has not been shy about trying to influence the Fed.

And while he told NBC News he doesn't know anything about the Department of Justice investigations, members of Congress, including some Republicans, say they're concerned the independence of the Federal Reserve is now at risk.

Consider this.