Justin Verrier

Right.

Just overall, just a little bit more impeccable and better than what Jokic has put forth this actual season.

But I don't know.

I think of those separately.

But Rob, do you think of those as more of one thing?

Well, it does kind of transition nicely to the Jokic versus Wemby sort of debate here because I kind of went back and forth with them at two and three.

I ultimately went with Jokic just because toward the end there, he had such an emphatic statement.

And for all the reasons Kyle's laying out, he's still probably the best offensive player.

But in totality, it seems like Shea just has it, especially this year in terms of resume.

I just don't really know what to do with Wemby at this point because he's clearly the defensive player of the year.

We'll get there eventually.

But yeah.

And that's the thing.

It gets into this old argument where it's like, how much do you weigh defense versus offense?

Where it's like, Wemby literally warps the way people play basketball now.

And he does it so regularly.

And I just don't know how to account for that because all the empirical stuff, the statistical stuff, isn't as caught up on the defensive side as it is the offensive side.

And so I almost wonder if there were these big honking statistics for Wemby to suggest how much he suppresses another team's offense.

There's stuff.

but it's just not to the level of sophistication or packaged in a way that's easy to understand for the layman.