Justyna Rzewinski
Appearances
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
it's not that like when they're off their medications this is who they are no because like i've seen them be completely different people and i've seen my patients be very sorry about the things they've done and they were genuine about things they did when they were off their medication so it's not like this is who this person is no this is what happens when the person is off their medication but they do have potential and not like i said i've seen it
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
I could read my eyes. There was a time where right before I left Rikers, I went on somebody else's unit to talk to a staff and a patient came up to me and he was like, hey, do you remember me? And I was like, no, I'm sorry. What is your name? And he told me his name and I could not believe it who I was talking to because when he was on my unit, he was locked in. He was screaming, cursing me out.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And he went to OMH. He came back and we were able to have a conversation. And he was like, yes, I'm going to stay on my medication. I took my medication when I was in treatment and it helped and like very motivated to continue a completely different person.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Yeah, I think what comes up often is people say they shouldn't have committed this crime and they wouldn't be in jail. They shouldn't have done what they did. That comes up so often because people justify it because they don't want to feel bad for the individual or have any empathy for the individual. So they justify and say, these are the consequences. This person committed a crime.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Once again, I have to educate them like, yes, they did. And we're not the judge or the jury. Nobody is saying that it's okay to commit crimes, but we're working on prevention because eventually these individuals will be returning to the community. So just educating them about that and the mental illness that like, yes, they committed a crime, but they were not on their medications.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
They were sleeping on the train. I had so many patients say they were sleeping on the train because they did not want to stay in the shelter. So it's a little bit more complicated than just committing a crime. There's more that goes into it. And like I said, if we really want our communities to be safe, we need to help these individuals so that this doesn't continue to happen.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So when they're released, they're not released to the same type of environment where they can commit another crime.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So right now I don't. So I work with individuals who are arrested but not arraigned. But before I worked on Rikers, I worked with people on parole. So they were just coming home and they were mandated to treatment. So that's what we did. We would connect them to a lot of different supports because a lot of times they didn't have the support and had to live in a shelter.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
because they were mandated to live in a shelter, didn't have a job. Some of them have been away for a very long time. So we would help them with getting a job or help them with getting a appointment to see a psychiatrist, to see a therapist and help them navigate all of that and remind them of that and remind them of those important appointments that they have.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Hmm, that is a hard, hard question. Working with people on parole, I did it for 11 years and I absolutely loved it because I think there were so many misconceptions and still are about this population. And I've met so many incredible people that have overcome so much just being in prison and then coming out. and reintegrate. I love that job. I really loved working on Rikers.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
I loved working with the patients. I didn't like what I was seeing being done to them, but I loved working with the people that were incarcerated there. And I really enjoyed this. I don't know. I don't know. It's so hard to say. I knew that I would be working within this field. So I would never switch to another field and work with me, children or families. I knew it was going to be in this field.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And that's why when I was looking for another job, I applied to this job because I wasn't going to just leave Rikers and go work as just a therapist somewhere in an outpatient clinic. I knew that I wanted to work within the criminal legal system, but I love all parts of it.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
you know, how they treated people with a severe mental illness and we're working to eventually close it or while it's not being closed for a federal receivership to take over.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Certain laws that we're trying to pass, I think we have a good chance of it. I've been a part of it. These laws have been tried to be changed for years. But I think definitely me coming out and my story has made an impact and hopefully will help the law to become law. It's not just because of me, like there's been advocates who have been working on this for a long time. But
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
I think me sharing my story will help because I do talk about how there is no mental health treatment in a jail. And that's why we need to invest the money that we are investing in jails into mental health treatment. But those things take time. Immediate impact that I had, like I said, just having those individuals not be locked in and then being investigated.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
The investigation is also going to take a long time. So that has definitely made an impact. But all the other things that I am working on is going to take time.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
But I'm happy to be a part of it. We're also working, me and some other advocates are working to pass a bill that would mandate all healthcare professionals to report any abuse that they see. And I think that would be amazing when that bill gets passed, because I remember... working on Rikers, there was no agency that I could call to report what I'm seeing.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And I was very shocked by that because I worked in outpatient, we would call the justice center. And I was so surprised, like we're mandated reporters and we see people being abused and like, we don't call anyone. So they investigate. I'm a part of that effort.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And when there are conferences or speaking engagements, I talk about my experience and how I would love to have an agency that I would be able to report to what I saw. And I think If that was in place, then I probably would have still been working there. I had to leave and report it to the media because there was nowhere else to report it to.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
If a child is being abused, we contact CPS, but there's no format, there's no organization, that agency that we call CPS. When we see abuse happen in jails and prisons, I think that would make such a big difference for me. I'm working with the other advocates to help pass that bill, but that's going to take time.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
I really think that we need to rethink how we provide treatment for people with a mental illness, that jail or prison is not the place for them. And we're not saying that they shouldn't face consequences, but these individuals do need treatment and they should not be in a jail or prison because no matter...
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
how great the jail or the prison is, at the end of the day, it's still a jail and it's still a prison. And that's not the place for these individuals. And like I said, they are coming out to the community. We can't just throw away the key. And I think also what I found through this, my whole experience is how really powerful your voice is. Because going into this, I never imagined
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
that all of this would happen. I didn't think my story was so big and me speaking out would have an impact. It did. I think anytime we do see any type of abuse, any type of mistreatment, we need to speak out about it because there were people that work on Rikers, people that left and nobody spoke about it. And I did, and it did have an impact. Our voice does matter and we can make an impact.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Some people say, oh, these systems, they're never going to change. We shouldn't even try. No, our voice does matter and we can make an impact.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
No, thank you so much. Every time I get an opportunity to speak about and educate more people, that's why I do this work.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Yep. The goal is for it to be closed, and it's actually the law that it needs to be closed by 2027, but that's not going to happen by 2027. And the plan is to build smaller jails in each borough. and then allocate that money that's left over for community resources. Because the budget for DOC is $2.8 billion per year.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
But if it's closed and the smaller jars are all built, that would save around $1 billion. per year. So there is construction taking place. I don't remember which borrows, but there is. And like I said, this is a plan and it's the law. So it does have to close. It just depends on when, because the deadline was 2027, but it's not going to happen by that time.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
The Rikers Island Jail, it's on an island, so it's really difficult for people to come in and visit their loved ones or lawyers. It's a whole day trip just getting on the island. If the smaller jails are built in each borough, it would also make it less difficult for people to be able to go and visit.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So I've... I've been involved with different organizations. Like last Friday, I spoke at a rally because it was the Committee of Criminal Justice budget hearing. We had a rally in front of City Hall and me and other advocates, as well as people who are incarcerated, spoke about their experience and also where the money should go and how
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
We want the money to go into alternatives to incarceration, mental health courts, so that people with a severe mental illness don't end up going to Rikers, that they actually receive the kind of treatment that they need. Because as I witnessed on Rikers Island, People don't get any mental health treatment. They actually get worse. And these individuals are coming back into the community.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And that's how they're being released from Rikers Island. Not medicated, traumatized. And I'm not saying people with a mental illness commit a crime, but... They don't have the support to help them if they're not on their medications. There's a risk for that. It's our doing as a society not supporting these individuals and providing them with the help that they actually need.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Exactly. I've also been working with different coalitions. In January, I went up to Albany and spoke at a press conference there about the Court Expansion Act, which we're trying to pass, which would extend mental health courts and programs in the community.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So my like nine to five full-time job, I'm working in a supervised release program. So this is pre-trial. So this is when somebody is arraigned and they go before the judge and the judge decides if they're going to set bail. If they set bail, that means that individual will be on Rikers Island fighting their case. And if the judge decides
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
recommends supervised release then they're being able to fight their case while being in the community so what we do is we make sure that they attend all of their court appointments they come in and do check-ins with us and we also connect them to outside resources
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So they have a lawyer assigned to them right away. So we do not help with that. We do communicate with the lawyers and we let them know if the participant hasn't come in, but that's through the court. Yes, we connect them to mental health services, but also other services such as employment or education, housing. These individuals come with a lot of issues and a lot of needs.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So we are able to do all of that. We refer them to programs where they hire people who have involvement with the criminal legal system. We refer them to GED programs or college, whatever needs they have.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
From the whole Rikers situation?
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Yeah, it's been very positive. I've gotten so many supports. I've met so many people in this work and they've been very supportive. Unfortunately, people at Rikers are not, and I have very few people that I still talk to. Most of the people just don't talk to me, but I received so much support on the outside from lawyers, advocates, people in this work. It's been very overwhelming in a good way.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
They're really happy. And they ask me, we're doing a rally. Do you want to come and talk? I've been working with lawyers on certain things. Legal Aid has a lawsuit against DOC for lack of access to medical care. And I was able to provide an affidavit for that. And what I witnessed, how individuals there do not receive medical care. It's been really positive working with all of these individuals.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
From what I've heard, and I don't know if this is true, but this is what I heard, that they're no longer deadlocking individuals. And if somebody is locked in, they're only locked in for a tour. And then the officers are told to let that person out. And I couldn't believe that when I heard it, because I remember working there and having...
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
People on my unit locked in for weeks and months, and it was a number of people. So just hearing that nobody's locked in only for a tour, I couldn't believe it. I was like, wow, I did that. To me, that's amazing because it was happening in every unit. So I didn't know that I would have such an impact. There's currently investigations going in. So this is being investigated.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So they have taken my concerns and what I discussed very seriously. And I really did not think it was going to be such a big impact.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Yes. So definitely letting the public know about how people with a mental illness are treated in a jail, because a lot of people don't know. If you don't have a family member, if you're not doing this work, you have no idea. And this is where we sent the most vulnerable people. to a jail where they don't receive any treatment. So I'm always trying to make the public aware.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And even though they're not locking in anyone, it doesn't mean the work stopped because that's happening right now. I want to make sure it continues and not because now they're on the spotlight, they're not doing this. And then a few months pass, some time passes and they go back to it. So that's my goal.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And like I said, to help those Rikers and help extend more programs where people actually get the mental health treatment that they need.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Yeah. So I try to educate people and I say, eventually these individuals will be coming out of jail. We're not the judge and the jury. We can't just throw away the key and really educating them about what the system does to them by locking them in a cell and not giving them access to medications. These individuals were born with this. It's not like they brought it on themselves.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And we need to help them as a society. And I often talk about how while I was working on Rikers, some of my patients, most of my patients were found unfit to stand trial and they had to go to an OMH facility to be restored to fitness. And I remember when they would come back, they came back completely different people because they were medicated. They were not locked in
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Thank you for having me.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
They were able to participate in group. And I always say I was able to have a coherent conversation. They were unrecognizable. And it's just like any other medical condition. If you have diabetes, you have to take medications for it, just like with mental illness, with certain mental illness like schizophrenia and other disorders. When individuals
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
may commit a crime or do something like it's not because they really want to. First of all, they may be off their medications. They may be experiencing auditory or visual hallucinations. A lot of my, all of my patients that I spoke to on Rikers Island, like they all told me when they were arrested for the crime that, All of them were off their medications.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
And like I said, I'm not saying that every person with schizophrenia commits a crime, but they were off their medications. They were living on the street, homeless, riding the train, no support, no help. We as a society, if we really care about community safety and we want everyone to be safe, we have to help these individuals.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
So since Rikers, let me see what has changed. I've just been really involved with different organizations that are working to close Rikers. So I've been doing a lot of work with that and attending conferences, doing some speaking engagements.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Yeah. Like I said, just education, because I find that like people are not educated about mental illness and don't really understand it. And like you said, only see certain things on the media. They have so many misconceptions. So working with this population, I tried to address those misconceptions and just educate them and
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Justyna Rzewinski : A Whistleblower's Fight for Mental Health in Prisons
Like I said, I often talk about, especially when I'm advocating for mental health treatment, that mental health treatment does work because I've seen my patients come back completely different. A lot of them didn't even remember the way they were acting when they were off their medications, completely different people.