Keith Payne

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts, or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert, experts on expert. I'm Dax Shepard. I'm joined by Monica Padman.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts, or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert, experts on expert. I'm Dax Shepard. I'm joined by Monica Padman.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts, or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert, experts on expert. I'm Dax Shepard. I'm joined by Monica Padman.

Hi, I have for six and a half years spoke about one of my favorite books called Broken Ladder. And the author of that book is Keith Payne, who is a professor of psychology at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill.

Hi, I have for six and a half years spoke about one of my favorite books called Broken Ladder. And the author of that book is Keith Payne, who is a professor of psychology at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill.

Hi, I have for six and a half years spoke about one of my favorite books called Broken Ladder. And the author of that book is Keith Payne, who is a professor of psychology at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill.

Very. Is it?

Very. Is it?

Very. Is it?

Par excellence. Yeah.

Par excellence. Yeah.

Par excellence. Yeah.

Berkeley.

Berkeley.

Berkeley.

Yeah. That's the University of California, Berkeley.

Yeah. That's the University of California, Berkeley.

Yeah. That's the University of California, Berkeley.

Can you believe it? That one does feel like Stanford, right?

Can you believe it? That one does feel like Stanford, right?