Kevin Roberts

And the way you amplify that is to have competing voices come in and do public events.

We're not saying that having someone who disagrees with us on tax policy or education policy

is somehow going to now change our own policy, but we're saying we're confident enough in our own research, our own position, that of course we want to have public debates.

The big issue example I want to offer is our changing policy on China.

Heritage led the way.

on most Americans' beliefs, certainly mine, that America was going to prevail on China because our free market and American values were going to turn China into us.

And when I got to Heritage, by the time I got to Heritage, I was convinced by none other than Donald Trump that that was wrong, that China had been taking advantage of us, that American policy had been too weak.

The prevailing mindset, not just of heritage, but of the conservative movement under George W. Bush's presidency.

We can baptize them into our way of thinking.

Exactly.

And the thing is, that was well-intentioned.

And so I get to Heritage, and I had the same misguided thought, right?

So this is not Kevin saying, man, I've been right for 25 years, listen to me.

I get to Heritage and I say, guys, we have to change our policy.

And so what do we do?

We start having public debates, conversations on our stage at Heritage.

introducing, including for our own colleagues, that maybe we were wrong, well-intentioned.

And then we published this big paper in 2023.

And everything for us starts with the research in order for us to talk about it, right?

A new Cold War with China in 2023.