Krystal Ball
Appearances
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think we should have incentives to locate those facilities in rural parts of the country and in industrial Midwestern parts of the country that have been left behind. I actually think that Governor Beshear has done a pretty good job with attracting a good bit of that investment to Kentucky, but you would be able to speak to that more than I would be able to.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
That broke some of the just blanket, you know, free trade, just up the GDP, doesn't matter who's getting screwed in the mix. That broke some of that consensus. And Joe Biden, although he didn't tout it effectively because he was like half dead and, you know, it wasn't effectively sold to say the least, built on that and actually paired a
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
protectionist trade policy with industrial policy, just meaning that there were investments, there were incentives for companies to invest. And for the first time, really in our lifetimes, there was an increase in manufacturing jobs. And a lot of that was going to
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
But, you know, at my core, that's that's kind of where I come from. And, you know, it's it's informed by this. Another thing I think you and I both have in common, like You know, I'm from a rural area. I'm from an area that is much more conservative. So I think that has affected my political views of, you know, having that kind of outsider perspective, viewing things a little differently.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Absolutely. And these are the, you know, this is the direction the world is going. And if you look at China, they're investing massive amounts in technological development, both in terms of AI and their electric car industry. market is absolutely crushing us.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Like the only reason anyone buys American EVs at this point is because you cannot get a Chinese one because their product is so much better and cheaper.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Astounding. Yeah, that's exactly right. And so in any case, I mean, I think that is the kernel of the answer is you have to do some protectionist trade policy. You have to pair it with industrial policy. And then I think you need a much broader universalist. I think everyone should have health care.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And actually, that would be a great thing for business because right now businesses have to carry half of the cost of private health care. And it's a huge cost for them. It's part of why labor in the US is much more expensive than other part of why. So I think you need to have some of that precarity taken out of American society as well.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And I think you need to tax the rich more and use it to pay things for things like health care for everybody so that when people get sick, they can go to the doctor. That to me is the direction. And when I say that, I think Trump's agenda now is imperiling it is when he came in and released his insane random tariffs across the board on this one and 50 percent on Lesotho.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And we're going to, you know, tariff an island that only has penguins on it and China tariffs are going to be 145 percent.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
you have you are very much in danger of killing any um view of protectionist trade policy any like acceptance of tariffs whatsoever and again i'm someone who supported his original tariffs i supported the biden expansion of those tariffs and industrial policy i'm starting to sound like some you know cnbc free trader because i'm so opposed to the way that he has done this and i think it is creating a huge backlash across the board
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Against anything that could actually be fruitful in this direction. And that's one of the things that I'm actually really concerned about right now.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And then what was really formative for me was I lived in the industrial Midwest, very close to East Palestine, where there was that horrific train explosion, all of that, you know, in Ohio. And that area was completely decimated by this bipartisan agenda for NAFTA and for opening up permanent normal trade relations with China. And it really was a bipartisan project.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
No, I think that's reasonable. Like, I don't think there's any world in which a J.D. Vance or a Don Jr. or whoever is supposed to be the heir apparent is able to pull this off. I mean, you could see it even with Ron DeSantis, who was trying to do like a Trumpian thing. And people were just like, you're a dork. You're a dork.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
So I do think there is something unique about Trump's appeal that is really not replicable. I also think. I think that the first months of this administration have been generally terrifying.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
You know, I think the denial of due process, the idea that you could just pick someone up and lock them in a dungeon in El Salvador for life and assert that that's totally fine and good and something you want to continue doing. I think that's terrifying. I think Elon coming in with the...
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
you know, with the chainsaw and just getting rid of random agencies that he doesn't like without consulting Congress. You know, I think that also was a I mean, it was dramatically unconstitutional. I think that was also very terrifying. Also, just the fact of the richest man on Earth with all of these conflicts of interest across all these agencies being handed all of this unilateral power.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think that was deeply disturbing. I think using the justification of a national emergency to completely upend the the global economic order. I think that is very frightening. But... I feel that a lot of this at this point has been sort of, like, tried at its most maximalist and is being pulled back now.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
That's that's right. And I do think so with the tariffs, you know, I think that the bond market in particular freaked Trump out and he really has walked back. Now, that doesn't mean we still have 30 percent tariffs on China. That's a lot. Think of how much five percent inflation hurt people. And you're talking about 30 percent on China, 10 percent on everything else.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
They're talking about imposing even greater percentages to get like. There is going to be economic fallout and it will hit working class people the hardest. This will amount to a tax hike. Soon.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yes, absolutely. There's no doubt that there will be some economic fallout. How great? I don't think anyone can really say. So I don't want to downplay it, but I do agree that in those three areas, he has been sort of chastened. The tariffs, we're not going back to 145% tariffs on China. That's not happening. Whatever his plan was there, I personally think the plan with tariffs is just...
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
He likes power. This makes him every company have to come to him. Every country have to come to him. And he loves that. I think that's really what the tariffs are all about. But, you know, we're not going back to the most maximalist position there. I don't think on the deportations they're going to try more things. And, you know, I think we have to be leery.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
You've got them out there saying, hey, we might just suspend habeas corpus. But you do have at least the courts kind of checking them. The the overall immigration policy is now way more unpopular. And, you know, so I think that the most maximalist aims there have also been maybe somewhat checked. And so and Elon has, you know, basically.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And I saw the way that town after town there was just devastated and the impact that had on people's lives. And so that really kind of opened up my eyes to the political system and has made it so even though I'm definitely on the left, there's no doubt about that. You know, I tend to vote for, you know, I vote for Democrats because they're more aligned with my view than others.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
He set his political power on fire too when he threw all in on this Wisconsin Supreme Court race and he lost. And Doge is a laughingstock. And here's again where you have to hold two thoughts in your mind. Doge should not save anyone any money. Actually, I think it's going to cost money because when you're talking about gutting the IRS, that means guess what?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
They're not going to be able to go after rich tax cheats like – It seems to be a factor, potentially. I don't know. You tell me if you followed this. Doge cuts hit the weather service office that was monitoring the tornadoes.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Exactly. They want to be getting warnings when it's appropriate to get warnings. They want to be able to fly and know that their plane is going to land and not crash into another plane. And so you have Doge, which has failed in terms of the metrics they set out of this dramatic cost cutting and efficiency effort. The government is less efficient now.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Just try to get some question handled on your Social Security chat. Good luck. And they didn't save any money. But it did do a lot of damage. You know, there's genuine harm there to things that people rely on that they don't even think about. See, I think that's key.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
That's right. That's right. No, they won't. They're cutting LIHEAP, which is the heating assistance, low income heating assistance program, which affects a lot of like rural communities in Maine, for example. The coal miner health thing, I covered that closely. It's horrific. I mean, miners, I'm sure you probably know these statistics.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
They're getting contracting virulent black lung at younger and younger ages. And so, you know, the few things that have been put in place to track and to monitor and to that allow you to switch to a job that doesn't isn't, you know, is dust free. Those things have all been slashed. I mean, this has been this is a disaster for coal miners and for those communities.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
The you know, the Weather Service, important FAA, important cancer research, important in terms of disaster funds. West Virginia was denied some of the relief funds that they needed after those horrific floods that hit Kentucky and West Virginia in some of the poorest parts of the state and the state that already has been screwed and is suffering so much.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
It's also given me a sort of critical eye towards both parties, I would say.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Washington, same thing, denied disaster relief funds. Arkansas was initially denied disaster relief funds, but Since their governor is Sarah Huckabee Sanders, she was able to go and petition the king and make her case and get her funds released. But, you know, these are things that have real consequences.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Everyone feels no one will deny that there's waste that you could cut in the federal government. But let me tell you something, Matt. If you have no interest in looking for that waste in the Pentagon... you aren't serious.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
If you have no interest in looking for that waste with some of these Medicare fraudsters who happen to be also well-connected, one of them is Republican Senator Rick Scott, then you have no interest in actually cutting waste. So this was never truly about cost-cutting. In my opinion, again, it was about power.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think it was an ideological project because Elon Musk is an ideological radical who just does not think there should be government and certainly doesn't want that government checking in on his businesses to see whether or not they're complying with the law. So that's what this thing was really about on that metric.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Perhaps it was a success, but in terms of delivering efficiency or cost cutting in any sort of reasonable way for American people, it's a failure. And the fact that you could turn, you know, anyone, if you just say, oh, should the government be more efficient? Everyone would say yes.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
The fact that you could turn that project into something that is dramatically unpopular is actually pretty incredible.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think it's possible. I still hold on to a little bit of that skepticism.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah, and I really admire what he's done in the state. I think it's remarkable. Here he is, governor of Kentucky, a state that has trended dramatically to the right, and he's the most popular Democratic governor in the country.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
You can't look at that and say, oh, this guy doesn't have a chance whatsoever. Obviously, he's doing some things right. he's doing some things right. Now, if we go back to, and let me make the bull case for him, and then I'll tell you, you know, my skepticism, which is a little bit similar to yours, but, you know, the bull case for him is he really is kind of the polar opposite of Trump.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
know humble guy he's not um not super flashy you know here he is doing the work in a a difficult place that's you know had his share of ups and downs etc and you know really has tried to be in touch with the people here and still for his values too in ways that could have been politically difficult for him here in the state so i think that's the bull case for him the the challenge for him is you know we're talking about this new media ecosystem and you got to be able to go on and
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
You'll have a three-hour conversation with some podcaster, et cetera. And I still feel like he has a lot of that caution in him.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I tried to grab him at the DNC, and he was like, no. I'm just kidding. He's like.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I've tried to get him on our show. You know, he just won't do it. It's always a no. And like you said, like you're not going to talk to us anymore. Yeah, I mean, we're on your side, and you're not... Yeah, I mean, like, he really knows you.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think Andy, to me, he seems like he's a preparer, which I relate to. I'm the same way. He wants to know, okay, what are the questions going to be? How long is it going to go? What are the answers that I have planned out? And if it's outside of that, then it really feels like it's outside of his comfort zone. And so I think, I think he has gotten better. I noticed that too.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And you know, when he was doing his kind of like VP audition tour, I was like, oh, okay. Yeah, definitely. Um, but I think if he's going to make that step to the top level, He needs to get out there and do some reps in a longer form and get comfortable in that space as well. Because I just, I think it's essential at this point.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I just don't think that you will have a successful candidate again, who can't go on and feel comfortable in like a conversational one hour, two hour, whatever kind of a, um, you know, new media setting.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And you think that that's, you think that's the reason for his popularity in Kentucky?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Interesting. Yeah, that's that's very interesting because that cuts a lot against some of the national political narrative, which would say that, you know, the Democrats are really being punished for for the way they approached covid. And, you know, I know Andy came under fire for. Well, there's an age group.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Interesting. That's really interesting. Because, yeah, I mean, being, you know, on the outside now looking in, I just thought, OK, well, he's brought a good amount of like jobs to the state. And I did think that those COVID press conferences were probably important just for making people feel like this is someone who like they feel a direct connection to. Which is hard to do with politicians.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
They know him outside of being like a politician. Yeah, it's hard to do. And Kentucky is... Kentucky is a unique state too. I mean, it feels very like, it feels small. Like it feels like you have a connection to all these people around you. So it's not hard to imagine people feeling like this direct connect to Andy.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And of course the Bashir family is well-known and all those sorts of things to me probably play in. Right.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
How could he do it? He's got to lean into, though, who he is.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah. Yeah, I think that – I agree with pieces of that. So I'm much more of a Bernie bro than you are, and I actually can't stand John Fetterman because I think he cares more about a foreign country than he does about his own constituents with his obsession about Israel.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah, kind of like awkward, normal. Like, that's very relatable. The guy who just won for prime minister in Canada, who's this, like, super dorky technocrat. Carney, Mark Carney.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
um he was a central banker like that's who he is and one of the things that i've interviewed some canadian you know journalists about that election and that was what they said about him is he didn't try to like you know how sometimes politicians like they'll put on like the checkered shirt and they'll go with their picking up track jd vance to me is the cringiest like jd vance like tries to act like he's cool like dude i'm
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
It's a cautionary tale. It's a cautionary tale. Because people... He's not the only one who, you know, loses who they are in pursuit of power. You know?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
So did he try to justify to you the turn of something other than just, well, this is what I got to do? Or was it more just like, well, this is how the Republican Party is?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
No, when he was running – I mean, I think I genuinely think his stroke has changed his personality based on the reporting that's out there. And he is very different from when he was mayor of Braddock and when he was lieutenant governor and when he was running for the Senate. So, no, I had high hopes for John Futter. I was very excited.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah, that would be, that would be interesting. Like just the dynamics of that.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah, I did run. What did it teach me? So this was 2010. It taught me don't run as a Democrat in a massive Republican wave year.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
When I started, I was 27. I think I was 28 when the election happened.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I was pretty young, yeah. Wow. And... what did it teach me? Most of the lessons that taught me were unfortunately kind of negative because I came in so naive, Matt, so idealistic. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. And it's a good thing I did because if I had known I would never have done it. You were much smarter and much more like you were much savvier when you were considering a run.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
yeah i really thought like oh sure this is a pretty republican district but if i go in and talk to people and i've got a good agenda or whatever and it just doesn't work that way it's like okay what year is it what is the partisan lean of your district there's a lot of locked in partisanship that's just impossible to overcome there's the probably the deepest lesson it taught me though because i do think what we've experienced over the past number of years is there actually are more voters who are swing voters who are willing to move
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
then um and change you know ideological affiliation then i think we had been led to believe but i'd say the deepest lesson it really taught me is just how freaking central the money is the money is so central and it really in my opinion if you had to point at one root of all evil in our political system it really is the corruption of the money citizens united ruined american politics
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think that's a big part. There were some other decisions along the way, but it really is one of them. And Elon is the logical endpoint of that. You know, here's a guy who has spent more than a quarter of a billion dollars to elect Donald Trump. And as a reward, he gets to cut USAID and he gets to gut the consumer financial, like the anti-scam agency.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
He gets to make sure that none of his companies are going to be regulated. Like he just gets to come in and run wild. and have the president doing a Tesla ad on the White House lawn, et cetera. And that's the most extreme version we've ever seen. There's no other comparison to that in American history. You have to go back to like J.P.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I will say I overlooked some things about him because I loved that he came out of this blue-collar, working-class background, that he had this ability to relate to people that I thought is pretty unique in a Democratic Party that's mostly populated by lawyers and a lot of folks who don't have that direct working-class touch and connect background.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Morgan bailing out the government in the early 1900s to have anything that's even remotely comparable, right? But...
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
it is the logical endpoint of the wild wild west money of speech campaign you know open season no campaign finance limits whatever the system that we have at this point i think one is the logical endpoint and listen if you love if you're someone out there who likes elon and like you're into him and you're into doge and that's you know that's your thing Just then imagine it's George Soros.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Imagine it's Bill Gates. Imagine it's some other billionaire because it really is not so much about the individual person. It's about some of the richest people on the planet being able to use our country as their plaything. And that.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
That understanding when you run for office and you spend so much of your time just like calling rich people and begging them to give you a little bit of cash, that really becomes very visceral for you.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think that's right. I mean, if you go back and look at my campaign, quote unquote, scandal, somebody released these photos.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
It's embarrassingly tame. Like, it's actually embarrassing to talk about because it was such a big deal at the time. And it was horrible for me. I went through it when this came out. It was some photos of me goofing off at a party.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
No, I know one would. It's so hilarious. Like, oh my God, a young woman having fun at a party, God forbid. But I mean, I think also my name is being so weird, whatever. It was a whole thing. Now, there is no way anyone would care at all, at all. Today, I saw a congresswoman, Nancy Mace, who's out of her mind. She posted, like, today I will show my naked body. Like, what?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
But I think he's been just a completely different politician than than what I expected when he was running. And like I said, from the reporting from his staffers, from his own wife, it seems like the stroke genuinely did. He's even acknowledged this in some ways has genuinely changed his approach and the things that he's focused on.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah, and everyone's like, all right, I guess so. You know, I mean, that lady's so messy that it is just unreal. But, yeah, for her, they're just like, yeah, that's just Nancy Mace. What are you going to do? Lauren Boebert, the whole Beetlejuice thing. I mean, you just go on and on.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
She got reelected. She got reelected. So I don't know what you said in the past, Matt, in 2007 in a blog post or whatever, but I think you're good. Well, I just did.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Even in the Democratic primary at this point, because they're so desperate to appeal to the bros, they'd be like, oh, maybe this guy is on to something.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
He's just Italian, that's it. Yeah, don't worry about his sexual harassment.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Oh, you know, that's been talked about because I think there's a Minnesota Senate seat that's opening up and people floated him because he was a good senator. And he's smart. It's a shame we lost him.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah, you never know. Now's his time. He could definitely make a comeback if he wanted to. I don't think anyone would care at this point.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Oh, it was fun. It was great to see you too, Matt. Made me miss you, made me miss Kentucky and Louisville.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I know. It's kind of hard to get to. What do you mean it's hard to get to? It's a plane. It's hard to get to.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
But, you know, I think we have a system where politicians on both sides of the aisle are oftentimes are more in touch with the interests of wealthy donors than they are with the constituents that they purport to serve. Now, I happen to think in this Trump administration, we've seen an extraordinary acceleration
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I had three kids. Scott Jennings makes it every day. The radar's going out. Like, what am I supposed to do?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
of what was already a fundamental sort of tilted towards the rich system when you've got the richest man on the planet with all this power, when you've got all of these billionaires lined up behind Trump, when you have Trump himself using the presidency as a tool for him to make personal business deals and benefit his own family personally.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think you've seen an acceleration of those trends, but I think the seeds of it were planted in both parties long ago.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I mean, I think it comes from a betrayal. I think it comes from 40 years of the rich getting super rich and wages being completely stagnant. I think it comes from, you know, an economic collapse in 2008. I think it comes from the media and the political class lying us into war with regard to Iraq. I think it comes from this fundamental sense of betrayal.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And so it reads as truth telling when you have someone who says things that are, you And it feels like, okay, well, at least this person is different. And if the people I hate, hate him, maybe that speaks well to him.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yeah, I think what I've, I felt very in touch with the like understanding where Trump voters were coming from in 2016. I really got it. It's harder for me to get it now because at this point it's like, okay, but we saw what he did in office. He gave it rich people, a giant tax cut. Like he passed Paul Ryan's, you know, dream. tax cut. That was his primary accomplishment in office.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
He didn't do the things that he claimed he was going to do. And so honestly, it's harder for me now to really understand the enduring popularity among his base. Now, I think it's also important to put in context
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
he isn't that like as a historic matter he is the least popular president that we have had at this point in his presidency and you know initially he was doing better than he did in his first term at this point his popularity levels have sunk to you know the level of sort of divisiveness that he experienced during his first term as well but he demonstrates the fact that if you have
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
This core group of committed supporters who are just absolutely ride or die. And when you have, to your point about the Democratic Party, you know, a feckless party on the other side that's always just putting their finger in the wind and doesn't seem to really stand or be willing to fight for anything, who put up a candidate that I think was flawed in any number of ways. Right.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
then that is going to create a large amount of political power. I think Trump has understood that perhaps better than anyone else. And listen, the other thing, Matt, He's freaking funny. Like, I wish he wasn't so damn funny. You think that's a big part of it?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Yep, indeed. It's a pleasure, and I'm honored to be guest number two. I didn't get the number one slot, but I'll take number two.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
He knows how to tell a story. I mean, he gets up there. He told that story about his fat friend who's a businessman.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I think comedy is a superpower. I think that's something you benefit from as well because you're a very funny person too, just naturally. And you see these comedians who have these giant podcasts now who are really influential, the Tim Dylans, the Joe Rogans, the Theo Vons of the world.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And so I do think if you are just a funny, genuinely funny person, you also get away with a hell of a lot more than anyone else. And I think that's one of his secrets of success as well.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I mean, I don't think that it's something that can just be like crafted in a lab, you know? I mean, you have the audience that you have because that's organic to you. If some billionaire had approached you out of nowhere and it's like, we're going to make the bro pod.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I did just see a story today that there are billionaires who are going in this direction. So, Hey, you never know, Matt, it's going to be your ticket. But yeah, I mean, Here's the other thing is, number one, it has to be an organic growth audience situation. And there are people who are liberal or on the left who do have significant audiences. And as one of those people...
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I can tell you the Democratic establishment has been terrified of going on our show. Basically the only, I shouldn't say the only, but one of the only politicians on the Democratic side who's willing to go on with us is Congressman Ro Khanna from California. He's great. He mixes it up. He'll go on with anyone.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
But by and large, they've been very fearful of these spaces because they're a little bit less controlled. Now, I would say the interviews that those guys gave to Trump. Oh, they're weak. They're weak.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
Right. And so he knew that and felt like he could go on. And I do think he got something out of it because rather than people feeling like this is someone who's extreme and who's a break from the norm or the mainstream in American politics. You listen to him for three hours on show and you're like, oh, this is just like a normal guy. What's everybody on about?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And meanwhile, now he's back in office. He's doing even more extreme things than I had anticipated. I was very much accused of Trump derangement syndrome going into this election. So I think it did serve his purpose.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And I do think that it is incumbent, even if you are a comedian, if you're going to host someone who's so powerful to do a little prep and be able to do a little bit of pushback, you know, But on the other hand, I also think Democrats, like this is the world we live in. You got to be prepared to swim in those ponds.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I mean, I don't know how normal I am. Like, I'm a complete political nerd, whatever, like doing my thing. But I think your point is well taken. And, you know, I so I also think Democrats, they haven't adjusted to the new media ecosystem. And they also haven't. They're so risk averse.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
They're really terrified of saying the wrong thing and having a bad news cycle. And what Trump and some other Republicans have recognized is even if it's a bad news cycle, if people move on, move on, people move on. And if they're talking about you and you're driving the news cycle, that's actually better than just being boring and forgotten.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I mean, I would describe myself as populist left. So for me, you know, and a sort of economic analysis is really central to the way I view politics. And that doesn't mean that, you know, other things aren't important, that I don't focus on other things. Certainly right now in Trump 2.0, I'm focusing on a lot to do with deportations to due process and all those sorts of things as well.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
So, you know, I think there's now I do think now you're starting to see some Democrats try to like, you know, who's good at it. Yeah.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
I do think Pete is good at it. Now, I'm not a big Pete fan. I think he is kind of psychopathic. But anyway, he's good at it. He goes on, you know, he went on what he went on.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
And he did a good job there. Gavin Newsom launched his own podcast. I mean, that guy is fantastic.
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
The slicked back hair and all that. I've always thought he looks like a vampire, you know, like from a vampire movie, right?
The Matt Jones Show
Episode 3 - Krystal Ball
It's not easy. It's not an easy answer. But I mean, here's where I actually think that there has been a shift in consensus that is positive, that is now endangered by the excesses of Trump. And let me tell you what I mean by that. So Trump in his first term put some tariffs on China. I supported that. Because I think we should have a domestic manufacturing base.