Luke Harding
π€ SpeakerAppearances Over Time
Podcast Appearances
It was extremely acrimonious.
It was really almost kind of open hostility between Hungary and Ukraine, with Orban saying that he would block the loan until oil started flowing through this pipeline.
It's called the Druzhba pipeline, Russian oil to Hungary and Slovakia.
The Ukrainians said that Russia had bombed it.
It wasn't possible.
Orban said they were lying.
Now it looks like the money will come to Kyiv and also the oil will flow to Budapest.
So this is a breakthrough.
I mean, the other kind of quite interesting thing is a change of tone from Zelensky, because since Donald Trump came back to the White House last year,
He's really done everything he can to try and please Trump to treat him like a reliable partner, an ally of Ukraine, even though, in my opinion, Trump has swapped sides and supports the Russians.
I mean, we can talk about to what degree.
But Zelensky's rhetoric recently has been kind of much cooler, actually, towards Trump.
And I think really there's a kind of strategic realization by everybody that the Americans are practically out.
I mean, no more American weapons going directly from Washington to Kiev.
And that really supporting Ukraine is Ukraine's problem and Europe's problem.
Lucy, what you have to understand is that war has changed.
I mean, forget the Second World War movies you've seen of brave soldiers kind of running across fields and things like that.
I mean, the Russians still do that, but with very little success because practically they're all killed and injured.
And this has become a kind of superlative aerial contest, both sides using drones massively, a kind of race of technology.
And I think one other really interesting development is that