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Masha Gessen

👤 Speaker
332 total appearances

Appearances Over Time

Podcast Appearances

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

In the early 20th century, there was this anarchist idea about the propaganda of the deed.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

The propaganda of the deed was that there were these forms of direct action, and many of them violent.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

Assassinations, bombings.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

That when you did them, they were so spectacular.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

Everybody would hear about them.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

And when everybody heard about them...

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

There would be copycats by making the impossible possible, by making clear that society did not work how you thought it worked, that the state did not have the power you thought it had.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

They could rupture society itself and create the possibility of a moment of revolutionary upheaval.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

I think there is a way in which you should and can understand the Trump administration as operating often

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

through propaganda of the deed.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

Now, they're not an anarchist collective.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

They're a state.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

They're a regime.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

But they operate not so often through the dull work of rules and laws and legislation and deliberation, but through spectacle and through the meaning of particular spectacles.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

Venezuela was a spectacle.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

They do not seem to have planned for the aftermath.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

They were decapitating the Maduro regime, but they left the regime otherwise completely in place.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

Nobody seems to know, even in the administration, what it means for America to be running Venezuela.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

But it was an example, an act that showed something.

The Ezra Klein Show
Venezuela, Renee Good and Trump’s ‘Assault on Hope’

And even before the capture of Maduro, they had chosen not to fight the drug war, the fentanyl scourge, through laws and legislation on addiction and drugs, but instead do these very high-profile bombings of alleged drug boats that, even if they were drug boats, were probably carrying cocaine because fentanyl doesn't come here that way.

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