Masha Gessen

To the population. Right. Right. They're usually economically beneficial to the actual autocrat and his cohort. And you will not necessarily be personally better off. So what is he going to actually give them? What he's going to give them is a sense of belonging to something greater.

To the population. Right. Right. They're usually economically beneficial to the actual autocrat and his cohort. And you will not necessarily be personally better off. So what is he going to actually give them? What he's going to give them is a sense of belonging to something greater.

Yeah. Yeah. The greatest country in the world that is expanding its borders.

Yeah. Yeah. The greatest country in the world that is expanding its borders.

Well, the problem is that we're always looking for that one thing or those three things. And now once we check them off, we're living in an autocracy. The problem is it's actually always a gradual process. And it's happening much faster here than it's happened in any country that I'm familiar with. Really? Yes.

Well, the problem is that we're always looking for that one thing or those three things. And now once we check them off, we're living in an autocracy. The problem is it's actually always a gradual process. And it's happening much faster here than it's happened in any country that I'm familiar with. Really? Yes.

I mean, it took Putin quite a long time to establish actual authoritarian rule and then another number of years to turn that regime into a totalitarian one. The way that Trump is taking a sledgehammer to government... is certainly unprecedented in my memory.

I mean, it took Putin quite a long time to establish actual authoritarian rule and then another number of years to turn that regime into a totalitarian one. The way that Trump is taking a sledgehammer to government... is certainly unprecedented in my memory.

But I think that things that we have to look for, some of them you can sort of measure like when they start consistently ignoring court decisions that are not favorable to them. So far they've ignored some, it seems like, but it doesn't look like it's consistent.

But I think that things that we have to look for, some of them you can sort of measure like when they start consistently ignoring court decisions that are not favorable to them. So far they've ignored some, it seems like, but it doesn't look like it's consistent.

But at some point I would expect them, or let's say I will fear that they will say these court decisions that go against the government are illegitimate. So that will be a huge marker. But then there are softer things like shifting consensus. And I think it's already happening.

But at some point I would expect them, or let's say I will fear that they will say these court decisions that go against the government are illegitimate. So that will be a huge marker. But then there are softer things like shifting consensus. And I think it's already happening.

Like that's one way of understanding what people have also been calling the obeying in advance that we have seen sort of all over the place. The most vivid example of it is by far not the only one, right? But it's Mark Zuckerberg's little address when he announced that they were not going to have fact checking on Facebook anymore. He kept saying, you know, things have changed.

Like that's one way of understanding what people have also been calling the obeying in advance that we have seen sort of all over the place. The most vivid example of it is by far not the only one, right? But it's Mark Zuckerberg's little address when he announced that they were not going to have fact checking on Facebook anymore. He kept saying, you know, things have changed.

This is a new moment. We're going to move our operations to Texas because that's the new moment we're living in. All of these things are sort of ways of saying, look, I'm fully accepting that Trump has created a new reality. And I'm going to take all my things and move into that reality with him and live there with him. And anybody who refuses to do that, they're going to be left out in the cold.

This is a new moment. We're going to move our operations to Texas because that's the new moment we're living in. All of these things are sort of ways of saying, look, I'm fully accepting that Trump has created a new reality. And I'm going to take all my things and move into that reality with him and live there with him. And anybody who refuses to do that, they're going to be left out in the cold.