Mia Freedman

So it sort of talks about how this second rebirth is often triggered by divorce because after years of carrying a domestic mental load or making compromises because of your partner or considering your partner, when you get divorced, it's a time of intense self-focus and

And, you know, it's funny, they quote one woman, a comedian, who's 36 and she's not actually even divorced.

You're listening to a Mamma Mia podcast.

But you know, Em, what I was thinking about this is, you know how when Timothee Chalamet and Kylie Jenner got together, it really changed what everybody thought about both of them?

Because it was such an unexpected match, you were just like, oh, neither of you are quite who I had pigeonholed you to be, perhaps.

And that's what this relationship's doing.

It's really scrambling me to try and make sense of...

Any of it.

I think not since the Texan toe-sucking incident, which I think you two might have even done an episode of your Lowbrow podcast talking about that.

Such a good episode.

Can you bring people up to speed, either of you, on that in case they've forgotten?

Gen Xers won't have forgotten.

She was called a breath of fresh air because Princess Diana was so...

Oh, well, she was amazing but so elegant and so contained in public.

Tortured, some might say.

Tortured but publicly.

And Fergie just seemed like a good time.

Yeah.

Fashion is art just means nothing.

Well, I thought that's kind of the theme every year because the Met is an art museum and this is the costume bit.