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Michael Levin

๐Ÿ‘ค Speaker
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4080 total appearances
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Podcast Appearances

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

It used to be thought that because all tadpoles look the same and all frogs look the same, if you just remember, if every piece just moves in the right direction, the right amount, then you get your frog, right?

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So we decided to test.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

I had this hypothesis that I thought actually the system is probably more intelligent than that.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So what did we do?

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

We made what we call Picasso tadpoles.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So everything is scrambled.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So the eyes are on the back of the head, the jaws are off to the side, everything is scrambled.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

Well, guess what they make?

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

They make pretty normal frogs because all the different things move around in novel paths configurations until they get to the correct froggy, sort of frog face configuration, then they stop.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So the thing about that is now imagine evolution, right?

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So you make some sort of mutation and...

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

It does, like every mutation, it does many things.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So something good comes of it, but also it moves your mouth off to the side, right?

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

Now, if there wasn't this multi-scale competency, you can see where this is going.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

If there wasn't this multi-scale competency, the organism would be dead.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

Your fitness is zero because you can't eat.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

And you would never get to explore the other beneficial consequences of that mutation.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

You'd have to wait until you find some other way of doing it without moving the mouth.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

That's really hard.

Lex Fridman Podcast
#325 โ€“ Michael Levin: Biology, Life, Aliens, Evolution, Embryogenesis & Xenobots

So the fitness landscape would be incredibly rugged.