Michael Pollan

Actually, the food industry spends more on lobbying than the defense industry. So that gives you some idea of the scale of it. It's, it's vast.

Actually, the food industry spends more on lobbying than the defense industry. So that gives you some idea of the scale of it. It's, it's vast.

Actually, the food industry spends more on lobbying than the defense industry. So that gives you some idea of the scale of it. It's, it's vast.

Well, we went to a company called upside, which is, uh, near me here in Emeryville. Uh, And they are a very well-financed company with all the big players in agribusiness owning a piece of it. And I don't know why exactly, whether they believe in it or they want to control it or have a window on it. I don't know. But they're all there.

Well, we went to a company called upside, which is, uh, near me here in Emeryville. Uh, And they are a very well-financed company with all the big players in agribusiness owning a piece of it. And I don't know why exactly, whether they believe in it or they want to control it or have a window on it. I don't know. But they're all there.

Well, we went to a company called upside, which is, uh, near me here in Emeryville. Uh, And they are a very well-financed company with all the big players in agribusiness owning a piece of it. And I don't know why exactly, whether they believe in it or they want to control it or have a window on it. I don't know. But they're all there.

It started by a doctor, actually, a cardiologist who adopted some of the techniques he was using to repair the heart with stem cells.

It started by a doctor, actually, a cardiologist who adopted some of the techniques he was using to repair the heart with stem cells.

It started by a doctor, actually, a cardiologist who adopted some of the techniques he was using to repair the heart with stem cells.

Uma Valetti, yeah. And he's very dedicated, very idealistic. And we were given a tour and we saw these great stainless steel vats. It looks like a brewery. Um, and it's, it's very similar kind of equipment. And in those vats, uh, are cells that are removed almost by, you know, it's a biopsy essentially. You don't have to kill the animal.

Uma Valetti, yeah. And he's very dedicated, very idealistic. And we were given a tour and we saw these great stainless steel vats. It looks like a brewery. Um, and it's, it's very similar kind of equipment. And in those vats, uh, are cells that are removed almost by, you know, it's a biopsy essentially. You don't have to kill the animal.

Uma Valetti, yeah. And he's very dedicated, very idealistic. And we were given a tour and we saw these great stainless steel vats. It looks like a brewery. Um, and it's, it's very similar kind of equipment. And in those vats, uh, are cells that are removed almost by, you know, it's a biopsy essentially. You don't have to kill the animal.

Uh, you just need cells and you start duplicating them and you have to feed them. And one of the challenges, there are two big challenges, um, scaling this is that the feedstock, which has to be pharmaceutical grade, this is the kind of feedstock you would use if you were growing cell lines in a laboratory, it has to be perfectly clean.

Uh, you just need cells and you start duplicating them and you have to feed them. And one of the challenges, there are two big challenges, um, scaling this is that the feedstock, which has to be pharmaceutical grade, this is the kind of feedstock you would use if you were growing cell lines in a laboratory, it has to be perfectly clean.

Uh, you just need cells and you start duplicating them and you have to feed them. And one of the challenges, there are two big challenges, um, scaling this is that the feedstock, which has to be pharmaceutical grade, this is the kind of feedstock you would use if you were growing cell lines in a laboratory, it has to be perfectly clean.

And it's a mix of amino acids and fats and sugars and micronutrients, I assume. But you get a single bacteria in there and the bacteria will multiply much faster than your meat cells and you've got to throw out the whole tank. So, The issue is, and pharmaceutical-grade feedstock for cells is not cheap.

And it's a mix of amino acids and fats and sugars and micronutrients, I assume. But you get a single bacteria in there and the bacteria will multiply much faster than your meat cells and you've got to throw out the whole tank. So, The issue is, and pharmaceutical-grade feedstock for cells is not cheap.

And it's a mix of amino acids and fats and sugars and micronutrients, I assume. But you get a single bacteria in there and the bacteria will multiply much faster than your meat cells and you've got to throw out the whole tank. So, The issue is, and pharmaceutical-grade feedstock for cells is not cheap.

The issue is, can a company like Cargill make trainloads of this stuff that will be so clean that you can use it? And that's a really open question. There's nothing that clean in our food system. If you've been in a slaughterhouse, if you've been in a grain elevator, doing things at that level of cleanliness is going to be very difficult.

The issue is, can a company like Cargill make trainloads of this stuff that will be so clean that you can use it? And that's a really open question. There's nothing that clean in our food system. If you've been in a slaughterhouse, if you've been in a grain elevator, doing things at that level of cleanliness is going to be very difficult.