Michael Shellenberger
speaker
1,228 appearances
6 recordings
4 series
first heard Oct 2024
last heard 18 Feb
Michael Shellenberger’s voice in public audio — every appearance, attributed to the second.
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recordings per month · last 12 monthsRecordings per month over the last 12 months — 1 in all, peaking in Feb 2026 with 1.
Appearances
what we need to see much much more of at the high schools and the colleges which is getting people very comfortable with having difficult conversations and with having conversations with people whose values you don't share and who believe things that you find reprehensible and that is at the heart of it i don't know i mean it's sort of what's terrifying is that
You know, those numbers of intolerance kept increasing over the last 10 years.
I hope that we've hit an inflection point.
I will say, Tucker, one number that did change that I felt some heart in was that Pew had found that the share of Democrats that thought the government should be involved in censoring misinformation online had risen from 40% in 2018 to 70% in 2023.
They did the same question earlier this year, and it's now declined to 58%.
So
there is a chance at which the, I mean, it's still terrible, but like the sense in which that trance has broken, you know, that hypnotic, we have to fight misinformation that just bonkers anti-American, un-American impulse.
it feels like it was broken but i still think there's a lot of that you know cultural work that we need to do to really educating kids because i just don't think free speech is intuitive i mean you go to a playground and you see little kids playing and they just are yelling shut up shut up at each other all the time it's our natural instinct you hear something you don't like you want to shut them up and the alternative to listen to somebody and actively disagree with them
and maybe think about how to respond or just figure out if you agree or disagree.
It's like a muscle, it just takes practice.
And I think we have to teach the kids, both the K through 12 and the college students how to do that.
And that doing that is a core value that will be rewarded in life.
And we should be celebrating rather than the opposite, which is this desire to silence and shut down.
yeah i mean just to answer that question i'll preface it by saying of course i watched very closely your interview with sam altman where you asked i think some very important questions which is what is the moral framework with which uh his ai will follow that is the right question and of course it remains an ever-present question it's not like it'll it will never go away
Ultimately, these decisions about what gets censored and what the AI censors for us are made by people.
And so you look at the worst episodes of censorship over the last five to 10 years, you can find the people that were demanding the censorship, you can find the groups they created to demand it.
you know that it was it was human decisions and that in fact at the company level in the twitter files there was a huge amount of debate around i mean not enough a huge amount of debate around uh deplatforming the president of the united states like removing the account of the president which is so insane
it was a big deal obviously it was talked about and then of course you could see it same thing with the hunter biden laptop where the fbi ran a deception operation against the social media platforms illegally in an illegal conspiracy that included spreading disinformation about the laptop um that was obviously a very elaborate thing that a lot of people could see and we're getting kind of glimpses into
There was also just the humdrum or the ordinary kind of de-amplification.
So you remember Twitter famously said, oh, we don't shadow ban.
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