Noel King
Appearances
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
Can manufacturing jobs be brought back to places like the Lehigh Valley as the people there would like? Vox's Dylan Matthews has been trying to answer this question, and we're going to start with what has been happening.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
Because our spending drives the kinds of jobs that make up our economy. OK, so what replaces manufacturing?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
And some of those jobs are extremely well-paid. Doctor, lawyer can make a ton of money. Some of those jobs are not as well-paid. Home health aid, for example. So when people talk about manufacturing jobs as good jobs and we say service sector jobs replace them, is manufacturing being replaced by good jobs? Yeah.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
And it's not just the stock market anymore. The national economy, we learned today, shrank in the first quarter of this year. Down three-tenths of a percent.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
So the trend is, it's not just in the United States, you said. The trend is, as a country gets richer, it moves from a manufacturing economy, a lot of manufacturing jobs, to a service economy, more service jobs. They can be great jobs or they can be less well-paid jobs. There are a lot of people still in America like John, the guy we heard from in the first half of the show, who...
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
have seen this shift and what they have seen is not progress, not getting richer. It is the community is hollowed out. People lose their jobs. How do we square this narrative of broad progress with the facts in a specific place like the Lehigh Valley?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
Vox's Dylan Matthews. Miles Bryan produced and reported today's episode. Jolie Myers edited. Laura Bullard checked the facts. Andrea Kristen's daughter and Patrick Boyd engineered the show. I'm Noelle King. It's Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
The American economy is starting to shake under the weight of President Trump's tariff chaos.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
If it shrinks in the second, that's the dictionary definition of a recession, folks. Chinese exports to the U.S. are plunging. Keep your third eye open for shortages. And around the country, tariff layoffs are underway.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
All true. This is a very well-known brand. So is this a good job?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
OK, so you were at the union hall. Are Dan and the other men and women in the union, are they mad about the tariffs?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
All right, so you have a union that is facing layoffs because of the tariffs, making the argument for tariffs. Why do they say tariffs are a good tool?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
All of this, says the press, to bring manufacturing back to the U.S., except, as we're going to hear, the tariff layoffs are hitting manufacturing now, too. Coming up on Today Explained, we take a trip.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
What did Dan and the others that you spoke to think of Trump now?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
Does everyone in the union come down on the same side as Dan in this?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
Like people who might vote Republican or might vote Democrat based on whoever they think is doing the best job for them. You said this is a swing area. How do you hear local politicians trying to capitalize on what's going on with the tariffs?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
This is the argument of the last 20 or 30 years that the American economy is moving on to other types of jobs. And we got to make sure that those jobs are good jobs and not spend so much political capital on people like the guys who work at Mac. What are the guys who work at Mac think about this argument?
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
John Tanizer there in the Lehigh Valley, brought to us by Miles Bryan. Thanks so much, Miles.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
Coming up, we know that what replaced the manufacturing economy was the service economy. Can that ever be as good? We're going to ask.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
It's Today Explained. Miles Bryan is a senior producer and reporter on the show. And Miles, you live in Pennsylvania.
Today, Explained
Tariffs hit like a Mack truck
President Trump's tariffs were supposed to bring manufacturing back to the United States. They're supposed to create jobs. But in Pennsylvania, some people are losing jobs as a result of the tariffs. What's happening?
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
President Trump addressed the Congress last night. You heard that. Uganda. But let's check in on Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth. He tweeted from the car on his way to the address.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
Noelle King here with Haley Britsky. Haley is CNN's Pentagon reporter and producer, and she's been following the DOD's plan to separate transgender service members from the military. Haley, what does this new Pentagon policy say exactly?
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
How is this new policy going to affect you? What does it mean for your career?
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
The Department of Defense is offering some terms for people who voluntarily leave the military in 30 days. We learned that in the first half of the show. Would you ever volunteer to go?
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
I'm hearing you say you wanted to and you plan to stay in the military until retirement.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
The Department of Defense has said that being trans is contrary to the, and here I'm going to quote Sam, high standards for service member readiness, lethality, cohesion, honesty, humility, uniformity, and integrity. You've been in the service since 2015. You know what this is driving at here. Let me ask you how you respond to that statement.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
He tweeted again a thank you after Trump mentioned him.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
Listener, did you know that every branch of the U.S. military has a creed? It must be memorized and sometimes quickly recalled. Petty Officer Second Class Sam Rodriguez can recite it without a hitch.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
Then he went on Fox News this a.m. to discuss enlistment numbers.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
President Trump and Pete Hegseth, the Secretary of Defense, have they come out and said why they think people who are trans are unfit to serve their country?
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
So the military is using the word separation, which is the word that it generally uses in cases like this. But it means people are losing their jobs. For people who are losing their jobs and didn't expect to lose their jobs, what are they receiving?
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
Neither Hegseth nor the president mentioned their plan to force transgender service members out of the military. Today on Explained, we're going to do that.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
We're assuming there will be legal challenges and we're in an environment where it's hard to tell what a legal challenge might lead to. But during President Trump's first term, as I recall, there were legal challenges to some of what he tried in the Pentagon.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
Can you take us back and tell us, as we start to see lawsuits and look for lawsuits, what we might be looking at here?
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
That was Haley Britsky. She covers the Pentagon for CNN. Coming up, so you've been serving honorably, and now you're out. We're going to hear what that's like.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
Today Explained is back. So this is kind of a universal experience. Your job changes a policy that affects you, and it is terrible because change is very hard. For most of us, this doesn't happen all that often. But Navy Petty Officer Sam Rodriguez's military service has been upended again and again and again by policy changes. Sam joined the Navy in 2015.
Today, Explained
Serving your country while trans
In 2016, a ban on transgender service members was lifted. Then Donald Trump was elected. And in 2017, Trump banned transgender service members. In 2020, Joe Biden was elected. Biden reversed the ban. And then in 2024, President Trump was elected. And his DOD is now firing trans service members.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Noelle King, host of Today Explained. We're here at 100 days of Trump part two. They say they like to flood the zone. And boy, did the zone feel flooded.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
But when John Bolton was asked about John Kelly's assessment, he basically said Trump's too dumb to be a fascist. I wanted to ask him if he still feels that way a hundred days into Trump 2.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
So you would quibble with the term fascist because it's just, what, simplistic or it's a slogan?
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
What was your impression of his approach, if not something leaning towards fascism or authoritarianism when you were in his administration the first go-round?
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
What have you thought of the first 100 days of the second administration so far?
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
I think you're getting at something that I'm constantly struck by, which is while this seems like a serious administration with serious ideas, Project 2025, what have you, there's also all of these distractions that make this seem like a bit of a clown car. The Doge firings and then hiring back of nuclear safety personnel, the infamous Houthi PC small group chat.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
The tariffs, no tariffs, tariffs, just kidding, no tariffs. I saw someone say, I wonder if the fall of the Roman Empire was this stupid. And that really hit for me. But at the same time, you've got the campaign of retribution we've spoken about. You've got defying court orders and challenging the judiciary. You've got the silencing of speech, left and right, the First Amendment.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
I mean, when you see these constitutional infringements, are you worried for the state of the republic?
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
You, of course, I believe, have worked under four presidential administrations from Reagan to George H.W. Bush to George W. Bush to, of course, President Trump. Does that, you know, historical long view that you personally possess, you know, work to your advantage in these trying times of ours?
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Since you were looking ahead to the 2028 election, let me ask you quickly before we go about the 2024 election. I believe you said you wouldn't vote for either candidate and that you would write in a true conservative like Dick Cheney. Of course, Dick Cheney went on to endorse Kamala Harris. Did that change your mind when you were in the voting booth there?
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Well, no one's ever said that on this show before, sir. I appreciate you bringing that to light. Thank you for your time, Ambassador Bolton. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it. John Bolton of the Bolton Pack, Noelle.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Laura Bullard and Gabrielle Berbet were on The Facts. I'm Noelle King. Sean Ramos-Furham. Today Explained.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Thank you. The penny. They were going to get rid of the penny. I think I still see pennies. Showerheads. Showerheads. Immigration. Daylight savings. I think we still have that too. Deporting some people who are citizens. Fighting with the courts. Withdrawing from the Paris Climate Accords. Doge.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
We got actually someone who was a victim of President Trump's retribution season. I don't think he got mentioned in your conversation with Andrew, but former Ambassador John Bolton, who also lost his security clearance on day one. We're going to hear from him, Noelle. Support for today's show comes from Upwork. Enough with downwork. It's time for Upwork.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Just like their name suggests, they want you to be able to up your level of work. Because as a small business owner, you want to be able to grow your business. But you don't want to take on more than you can handle. It's all about scalability. And with Upwork, they say they'll help you find the right people to grow your business at your own pace.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Upwork says they can help you find specialized freelancers in marketing, development and design. Experts that can help you take your business to the next level. And even more, they say companies at every stage turn to Upwork to get things done by assessing a global marketplace filled with top talent in IT, web development, AI, design, admin support, marketing, and more.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
You can visit Upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That is Upwork.com to post your job for free and connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's Upwork.com. Support for Today Explained comes from the NPR Politics Podcast. Politics might move fast, but the NPR Politics Podcast is there to help declutter it all for you. Every day. It comes on every day.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
The NPR Politics Podcast team focuses on one thing and boils it down to 15 minutes or less. Each episode makes it easy for you to understand what's going on in politics today. from the complete restructuring of the federal government to immigration policy to tariffs and trade to unpacking the first hundred days of Donald Trump's second presidency.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
You can tune in to hear about what's been done, what's to come, and what might change, and of course, what it means for you. You can listen now to the NPR Politics Podcast, only from NPR, National Public Radio, they call it, wherever you get your podcasts.
Today, Explained
100 days of payback
Today, Explain is back, and here's the reason I wanted to hear from John Bolton today. Bolton served in the first Trump administration as a national security advisor. He served alongside former Chief of Staff John Kelly, who last October told the New York Times that he thinks Donald Trump is a fascist.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
New York City Mayor Eric Adams has always been an odd guy. As a state senator, he made a video explaining how to search your kid's room for contraband.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
We called Barb because a relatively tiny number of people have held these jobs. And we wanted to know what she makes of the DOJ pressuring New York prosecutors to drop their case against Eric Adams.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Walk us through who gave the prosecutors in New York their marching orders and what exactly those orders said.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
After the resignations, I heard people ask whether resigning is the best move, because if everybody resigns, then eventually somebody does give in and do it. And the people who are ethical, who have, you know, backbones, they're not there anymore. What do you think about that tension?
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Katie Honan is a senior reporter at the nonprofit news site The City. Katie also hosts the FAQ NYC podcast. Yesterday, minutes before Katie dashed into a press conference with Eric Adams, we reached her in the rotunda of City Hall to ask her about the life and times of New York's mayor.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
And I think that puts us in a worse place. What do you think this scandal tells us about the Justice Department in the second Trump administration?
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
How do we get out of this? Do you think that Congress is going to do anything here?
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
The issue, of course, in New York is the quid pro quo. Donald Trump wants something from Eric Adams and Eric Adams wanted something from Donald Trump. But the vast majority of mayors in the United States and governors in the United States and other people in the United States who Donald Trump might want something from are not under indictment. Right.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
So is this situation in New York City just a one off or do you think it's part of a playbook?
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Barbara McQuaid, UMich Law School, former U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Michigan. Amanda Llewellyn and Devin Schwartz produced today's show. Jolie Myers edited. Laura Bullard checked the facts. And Patrick Boyd is our engineer. I'm Noelle King. This has been Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Before we get to the events of the past couple of weeks, what's his reputation as mayor been? What do New Yorkers think of him?
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
As mayor, there was the Urban Rat Summit. There was the baptism, his, at Rikers Island. And then there was the alleged corruption, the wire fraud, bribery, the indictment. And then came the order from the Department of Justice that all those charges had to be dropped. Ahead on Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Mayor Adams is a Democrat. Yes. OK, but he claims he was targeted by the Biden administration and then President Trump is elected. And that leads us to where we are today. What happened?
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
So is the case, are the charges against Adams really going to get dropped? We don't know yet.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
So you're a native New Yorker, and politics in New York can get weird. In your time covering politics in New York, where does this kind of stand on the scale of 1 to 10? Oh, I would say this is probably an eight.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
The city's Katie Honan getting ready to go into a Mayor Adams press conference. Good luck in there. Enjoy. I'll need it. Thank you so much.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Support for Today Explained comes from Greenlight. Greenlight believes that most people learn about saving and budgeting much later than they should. Greenlight wants to give you the opportunity to give your kids a head start with Greenlight. Greenlight is a debit card and money app that's made for families. Parents can send money to their kids.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
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Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Millions of parents and kids are learning about money on Greenlight. You can start your risk-free Greenlight trial today. Greenlight.com slash explained. That's Greenlight.com slash explained to get started. What's that? Greenlight.com slash explained.
Today, Explained
Quid pro bros
Barbara McQuaid teaches at the University of Michigan's law school. She served as the U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Michigan. There are 93 U.S. attorneys in these United States, and it is their job to enforce federal law. As all U.S. attorneys are, Barb was a presidential appointee. She was appointed by Obama in 2010, and she served until 2017.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Representatives from the U.S. and Iran sat down last weekend to try to strike a deal on Iran's nuclear program. These were the highest level talks between the two countries since 2018. And the big surprise is that they're going to meet again this coming Saturday. President Trump in the Oval Office yesterday was asked about Iran, and he said this.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
And Trita has been writing that there are real reasons to be optimistic about these talks. And he says this past weekend proves his point.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
How far away are the U.S. and Iran on an agreement? Like, what is a sticking point here or the sticking points here? Do we know?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Yes, Obama struck a deal with Iran in 2015. President Trump in his first term pulled out of it. Since Trump exited that deal in 2018, how much progress has Iran made on its nuclear program?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
You recently wrote a very good piece for Time magazine in which you said you are optimistic that a deal is possible here for three reasons. Walk through those three reasons for me, beginning with your first. Both sides, as you said, have strong incentives to reach a deal. What are the incentives you're talking about?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Reason number two you cited, you say that Donald Trump appears to not be following Israel's lead here. What do you mean by that? Why does that make you optimistic?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
The third reason you cite is that Tehran has been making some interesting overtures to the United States regarding investment. Tell us what Iran's leaders have been saying and what you think it is they're offering exactly. Yeah.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Let's go back to the first Trump administration and to two moments that appeared at the time to be really definitive on Iran. The U.S. and Iran did have a nuclear deal, and then President Trump pulled out of it. Why did he do that?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
So Donald Trump is the businessman president and Iran is saying, we see you, we recognize that, and we want to speak your language.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
On Monday, President Trump gave a press conference in the Oval Office, and he was asked about Iran a couple of times. He did not have the most articulate answers. He said, you know, Iran wants to do a deal with us, but they don't know how.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
He wasn't saying this is going to get done, but he also wasn't saying this is not going to get done. When you look at his remarks on Monday, coming as they did off the back of successful talks last Saturday, more talks this coming Saturday, where do you predict this all might be headed?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Trita Parsi is the executive vice president of the Quincy Institute for Responsible Statecraft. Trita's written several books on U.S. foreign policy in the Middle East and Iran. Gabrielle Berbet and Travis Larchuk produced today's episode. Amina El-Sadi edited. Laura Bullard checked the facts. Andrea Christen's daughter and Patrick Boyd engineered. I'm Noelle King. It's Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
OK, so tensions in 2018 go higher after Trump pulls out of the Iran deal. And then in early 2020, there was kind of a shocker of an assassination.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
In the heart of Iran, a public outpouring of grief, overwhelming the streets of its capital. Trump made a big mistake. Tell us what happened with Qasem Soleimani.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Maybe it's the weave, but President Trump seems to have profoundly mixed feelings about Iran. He believes that Iran tried to kill him last fall and the Department of Justice agreed and filed charges. But Trump is also reaching out to Iran in some ways that have Iran watchers thinking he might be very serious about making a deal. That's coming up on Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
OK, so now let's move into the present day. Your book, Revenge, contains some really shocking information about what was happening in 2024 while Donald Trump was running for office. There were concerns that Iran was trying to kill him. What happened?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
President Trump and the people surrounding him were legitimately terrified that he could be killed. Do we know ultimately how far this went? I mean, if at the time there were people in the United States with access to surface to air missiles, we would have to assume that they're still here.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Does the Trump administration today, as we speak, do they still worry about Iran and a threat to the president's life?
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
Alex Eisenstedt, this was great. Thank you so much for your time and your insights. We really appreciate this. Thank you. Alex's book is called Revenge. Now, we should note that in January, a week before Inauguration Day, Iran's president, Massoud Pazeshkian, gave an interview to NBC's Lester Holt in which he denied that Iran had ever tried to assassinate Donald Trump.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
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Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
According to Udacity, Udacity offers courses in AI, data programming, and so much more. Our colleague here at Vox, Alison Hamlin, got to try Udacity. Here's what Alison thought.
Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
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Today, Explained
Art of the (Iran) deal
I'm Noelle King. So the big news from this first round of Iran talks is that there will be a second round of talks this coming weekend. Trita Parsi, who joins us now, was not as surprised as many analysts. Trita is executive vice president of the Quincy Institute for Responsible Statecraft. He's also the author of several books about U.S. foreign policy in Iran.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
President Trump said on Truth Social today that he had a great call with South Korea's leader aimed at making a deal on the tariffs that have set the global economy on edge. In that same post, Trump said he's waiting for China to call. The administration says these Liberation Day tariffs will bring manufacturing jobs back to America. Why is that so important?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Critics of the tariffs will concede that there are very good arguments for reshoring production of things like semiconductors or electric vehicles. Those things are the economy of the future. We should make them here. But across the board, tariffs don't aim to do that. The way the Trump administration talks, we want to bring everything back to the United States.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
And that's why we're putting tariffs on T-shirts and screws and picture frames and bicycles and not focusing. Right. Once again, I'm just going to ask, do you think the Trump administration is doing it wrong?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Who in your mind is financing reindustrialization? At the moment, every time you turn on CNBC, there's a CEO cursing or crying. Confidence is not high. Who's paying for the t-shirt factory? Like if I'm a CEO, I say, oh, semiconductor factory. That's interesting to me. You know, am I going to take a risk building a factory that makes shoes or shoelaces? No, probably not. But
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
It's arguably a pretty good idea to put tariffs on chips that are coming in from elsewhere.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
No, because the shoes are going to cost a lot of money and Americans probably won't buy the $600 shoes. And therefore, to build the shoe factory to make shoes that people probably won't buy because they're super expensive doesn't seem like a good way to spend money. I mean, I could be wrong. I'm a journalist. I'm not an economist.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Do you think Americans are willing to pay more for stuff because it's made here?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Why do you think that? Is there data that suggests that's the case? Donald Trump was elected because people were concerned, people were furious about inflation, about high prices.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Oh, no, I totally get you. In fact, I'm sorry, I don't want to step on your answer. I thought your answer was compelling, but it does seem like we're both going on vibes. Is there data suggesting that Americans, if given the opportunity to pay more for a TV that was made in Michigan, for example, would do so? Like, surely somebody's done the studies on this. Yeah.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
In the first half of our show today, Vox reporter Eric Levitz talked about how some in your camp hope and believe that the return of manufacturing to the U.S. will lead to higher marriage rates, maybe even higher birth rates, more social stability. Is that your hope as well, that this is not just an economic revolution, but a social one?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Oren Kass of American Compass. Oren advises the Trump administration and some on Capitol Hill. Miles Bryan produced today's episode. Jolie Myers edited. Amanda Llewellyn fact-checked. And our engineers are Patrick Boyd and Andrea Christian's daughter. And a quick clarification before we let you go.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
On yesterday's show, our guest overstated the relationship between the combat anti-Semitism movement and Project Esther. The combat anti-Semitism movement supports some ideas outlined in Project Esther but has not endorsed the document itself. I'm Noelle King. This has been Today Explained.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
What is the America that did exist? What's the thing that the Trump administration is nostalgic for?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
There are some really dumb ways to answer that question. When you sit behind a screen all day, it makes you a woman. Studies have shown this. Studies have shown this. And some much smarter ones.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Are the two linked? I mean, yes, it's true that once upon a time, more Americans worked in factories. And it's true that once upon a time, more Americans got married and stayed married. Are those two things linked to each other, though? Yeah.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
So the idea is slap tariffs on everybody. That'll bring manufacturing back to the United States. That'll make our gender relations and our cultural relations, in addition to our economy, more like it was in the 1950s when, from the perspective of these guys, America was a more stable country. Could this plan actually work?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Coming up on Today Explained, the best minds. The White House advisor who's gone ham on tariffs defends his position.
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Vox's Eric Levitz. Coming up, the gentleman begs to differ. An economist explains why he's been telling the Trump administration that tariffs are the right move. So
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
Oren Kass and I talked on Monday afternoon. It was another day of big swings in the markets, a sign of global anxiety about the tariff plan. Oren is somewhat unusual for an economist. He's a supporter of tariffs and he has the administration's ear. He knew that Liberation Day would shock the economic system. So I asked him, did you know the shock would be this big?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
So do you think the Trump administration rolled this out wrong?
Today, Explained
The nostalgia economy
It's Today Explained. I'm Noelle King. Senior correspondent Eric Levitz recently wrote for Vox about the nostalgia that the Trump administration feels for a time when American manufacturing was at its peak. Manufacturing things in the U.S. makes a lot of sense if we're talking about stuff that we want to get ahead on, cutting-edge technologies like semiconductor chips, for example.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
When President Trump fired Timothy Hawk, the head of the National Security Administration and U.S. Cyber Command last week, he didn't say why. But Laura Loomer, who'd met with Trump a day earlier, took credit. She said on Twitter that Hawk was disloyal to President Trump. Laura Loomer, chaos agent, activist, proud Islamophobe, her words, influencer, trickster, trespasser.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Does Laura Loomer have either an official or unofficial position in the Trump White House?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Why did Laura Loomer set her sights on the NSA? Of all the agencies she could have taken a look at, Doge is going hard after just about everything in Washington. Why did she pick on the NSA?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
The NSA keeps a rather low profile. What kinds of threats to the country does it work on? What's its job?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Does the firing of these officials at the NSA, does it leave the United States more vulnerable to attacks, to cyber attacks, for example?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Vera, you're kind of the perfect person to talk to on this story because you are a national security reporter, but you also spent many years looking into right-wing figures on the internet, including Laura Loomer, which means you didn't just learn about her last week, like many people. Now that she has pulled this off, this is an enormous thing that Laura Loomer has managed to do.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Do we know anything about what she will ask President Trump to do next or who... she might target next?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Vera Bergen-Gruen is a national security reporter for The Wall Street Journal, WSJ.com. Gabrielle Berbet and Victoria Chamberlain produced today's show. Miranda Kennedy edited. Andrea Christen's daughter and Patrick Boyd engineered. And Amanda Llewellyn checked the facts. The rest of us, Hadi Mouagdi, Peter Balanon-Rosen, Miles Bryan, Avshai Artsy, Jolie Myers, Devin Schwartz, Sean Ramosferm.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
There's a story about Laura Loomer that I heard a while back that I really love. When she was in college, she tried to start a chapter supporting ISIS on her college campus.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Carla Javier, Amina El-Sadi, and Laura Bullard. Today Explained is distributed by WNYC. The show is a part of Vox. You can support our journalism by joining our membership program today. In this economy? Yeah, if you can. It's optional. Go to vox.com slash members to sign up. I'm Noelle King. It's Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Laura Loomer is like, she's like a prankster. Tell us about some of the pranks.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
She has Trump's ear, maybe even his respect. You don't want to be loomered. If you're loomered, you're in deep trouble. And she's just getting started in Washington. That's ahead on Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Laura Loomer seems to have a thing with President Trump and loyalty. Can you just talk a bit about loyalty? How she seems to be pegging people as loyal or disloyal to the president and how long that's gone on for?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
The provocateur right, which she's a part of, is full of conspiracists and coconuts and etc., Where does she fit in?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
So last week, Laura Loomer got herself an audience with President Trump. They met at the White House and you've done the kind of TikTok reporting on this. What happened?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Vera Bergen-Gruen of The Wall Street Journal coming up. Who's Laura Loomer's next target? And is it you? JK, JK, JK. We'll be back in a minute.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
We're back with Vera Bergen-Gruen. She's a national security reporter for The Wall Street Journal. President Trump fired several national security officials last week, but the firing that got the most attention was the head of the NSA and of U.S. Cyber Command.
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
Someone is running the NSA now, though. Yes, they have an acting director now. Gotcha. OK, so the question is, President Trump likes people who are loyal to him, for sure. But really, one wonders, how on earth could Laura Loomer have enough influence to get the president, her claim, to fire people in his national security agency?
Today, Explained
Laura Loomered the NSA
It's Today Explained. I'm Noelle King. And some of the best reporting I've seen on Laura Loomer comes from The Wall Street Journal's Vera Bergen-Gruen. Vera is a national security reporter who also covered the online right for a time. And so she knows her Laura Loomer lore.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
Let me ask you about the president's argument on reciprocity.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
Reciprocal. That means they do it to us and we do it to them. Very simple. Can't get any simpler than that.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
So when Trump held up his chart, it showed that Vietnam, for example, levies a 90 percent tariff on goods coming from the U.S. South Korea, 50 percent tariff. Donald Trump is saying these countries put tariffs on American goods and I'm going to fix it. Is he right? And if so, why was this going on?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
All right. That's a good clarification. We should be we should be skeptical of what we saw on the chart. Let's talk about China. Trump put tariffs on China in his first administration. Joe Biden then kept some of those tariffs on China and then Trump comes back into office and he puts more on. Was China ready for what happened yesterday?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
The golden age of America begins right now. On Today Explained.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
I'm Noelle King with Abdullah Fayyad. He covers policy at Vox, including trade. And this week, Abdullah wrote a piece about how tariffs are not all bad. Abdullah, in his first term, President Trump utilized tariffs. Then he was elected again, and he's utilized them even more. As of Liberation Day and this big announcement, do you understand what his philosophy on tariffs is?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
China is not a U.S. ally, but Donald Trump, as we've said, did put big tariffs on countries that are our allies, Japan, South Korea. Do you think that this move forces them to rethink how they deal with the United States?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
I was reading over the weekend that Japan, South Korea and China met for the first time in about five years to talk about trade among the three of them.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
Do we know what goes on in a meeting like that? I mean, it seems deliberately timed to Trump's announcement. Does a meeting like that make America nervous?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
If China becomes a more trusted trade partner to American allies than America is right now, what are the long-term implications of this for China?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
Mike, thank you so much for your time today. Thank you very much. Mike Bird, he's the Wall Street editor at leading newspaper, The Economist. Devin Schwartz and Gabrielle Berbet produced today's show. Jolie Myers edited. Andrea Christen's daughter and Patrick Boyd are our engineers. And Laura Bullard and Amanda Llewellyn kept us honest. I'm Noelle King. It's Today Explained.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
They've treated our farmers badly. Look, our country's been ripped off by everybody. That stops now. They manipulated their currency, subsidized their exports, stole our intellectual property.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
April 2nd, 2025 will forever be remembered as the day American industry was reborn, the day America's destiny was reclaimed, and the day that we began to make America wealthy again. It was Liberation Day.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
April 3rd, the day after, won't be remembered, if we're being honest, although there was some notable news. The stock market fell freely and precipitously. People panic bought everything from cars to wine to almonds. And those were just the texts that I got. CEOs lost their minds.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
You know, because every point in tariffs is worth more money than TikTok.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
So economists will often tell you that tariffs are a tool. And Donald Trump seems to be saying, yes, they are. And they're not, you know, a hammer or a wrench. They're a Swiss army knife. You can do anything with them. Why is that a problem, if indeed it is?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
So you wrote about when tariffs can be used beneficially, narrowly. What are some examples of when tariffs are a good idea? What did economists tell you?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
Right. So when President Trump made his announcement in the Rose Garden and he said he's going to put tariffs on imported cars and the goal of that is to make sure that Americans buy American cars. That seems like that really narrow focus that economists are telling you is useful if you're going to implement a tariff. So would they approve of the tariffs that Trump has placed on foreign autos?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
And America's allies, Mos Def, got on a call with China. Today on Today Explained, we celebrate our day after Liberation Day.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
One thing that President Trump and members of his administration say again and again that sounds very compelling on its face is that tariffs are going to make America money. In fact, there's a number they've been throwing around, $6 trillion.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
$6 trillion, and that's going to be much higher by the end of the year.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
When the administration says these are going to make us much richer and we can actually put a dollar figure on it, what are they talking about?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
All right. So the American economy is made up of many different things. We've got Main Street, Wall Street. We've got the markets. We've got who is employed. We've got what things cost. Americans deeply worried about inflation for a while now.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
When you talk to economists, what do they tell you about how all of these new tariffs that Donald Trump announced on Liberation Day, what do they tell you about how they'll affect the American economy?
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
Abdullah Fayyad, his article, What a Better Tariff Policy Could Look Like, is at Vox.com. Coming up, we pivot to Asia.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
Support for Today Explained comes from Built Rewards. These days, you can earn points in so many places. At the grocery store, the gas station, on a flight. Points, points, points. Wouldn't it make sense to earn points on one of your biggest monthly expenses? No. I'm talking about your rent. Built Rewards is here to help. Built says there's no cost to join.
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The day after "Liberation Day"
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The day after "Liberation Day"
And when you're ready to travel, they say built points can be converted to miles and hotel points around the world. You can start paying rent through built and take advantage of your neighborhood benefits by going to joinbuilt.com slash explained. That's J-O-I-N-B-I-L-T dot com slash explained. Joinbuilt.com slash explained to sign up for built today.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
We reached Mike Bird in New York. He was based in Asia, where many of the Liberation Day tariffs are aimed for many years. And Mike's first response when he heard the list of tariffs yesterday.
Today, Explained
The day after "Liberation Day"
It's really extensive, it's broad, and it's throughout Asia. We've got China, Taiwan, Japan, India, South Korea, Thailand. What are we hearing today from leaders of those countries? Anything notable?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
The Trump administration is justifying the arrest and detention of protester Mahmoud Khalil and Rumaisa Ozturk, who wrote an op-ed in a student newspaper, by calling them Hamas supporters. But when asked for evidence, the administration doesn't offer any. Here's a DHS official on NPR.
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
I'm Noelle King with Russell Contreras. He's a senior reporter at Axios who wrote that the Trump administration's actions to combat anti-Semitism by calling people Hamas supporters stems from a specific playbook. Russ, what's the playbook?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
Project Esther is named after figure Queen Esther. What's Queen Esther's story?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
We heard in the first half of the show about the actions that Project Esther recommends to fight anti-Semitism. Your reaction on reading it is what exactly? Do you think what they're suggesting will work, would work? No.
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
We've seen the Trump administration come out and, for example, insist that Mahmoud Khalil is a supporter of Hamas. When asked for proof, when asked for evidence, the administration hasn't been able to provide anything. Now, Project Esther names a, quote, Hamas support network as the root of a lot of anti-Semitism. We heard in the first half of the show that this is not like a real organization.
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
So what is the goal of saying Mahmoud Khalil and people like him are part of the Hamas support network?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
What does all of this mean for Jews in the United States?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
Dov Kent is a senior director with the Diaspora Alliance. If you're interested in this and you want to read Project Esther, you can find a link in our show notes today. Amanda Llewellyn produced, Jolie Myers edited, Laura Bullard and Victoria Chamberlain checked the facts, and Patrick Boyd is our engineer. I'm Noelle King. It's Today Explained.
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
Okay, so Project Esther comes from the Heritage Foundation. Who wrote it exactly?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
Why are these Christian conservatives so invested in fighting anti-Semitism?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
So where is this allegation coming from? On Today Explained, it might be coming from the same people who wrote Project 2025. Project Esther largely flew under the radar until now.
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
All right. So Project 2025 was 900 some odd pages. I read many of them, but I didn't read all. Project Esther is only about 33 pages. It's very easy to get through. Both of the projects are kind of built on thesis statements. What is the thesis statement of Project Esther?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
What is this thing, the Hamas Support Network? Is that a real organization?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
The Jewish community in the United States is very large and runs the political gamut. There are progressive Jews, there are centrist Jews, there are very conservative Jews in this country. How are Jewish groups responding to Project Esther and to what the administration is doing now?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
Russell Contreras is a senior reporter at Axios. When we return, many American Jews are deeply concerned about Project Esther, and we're going to hear why. Support for today explained comes from NetSuite. You don't know what the future holds. Just take a look at your 401k. It may be impossible to predict the future, but you can still prepare for it, according to NetSuite from Oracle.
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
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Project 2025’s next chapter
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Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
That guide is free to you, courtesy NetSuite at netsuite.com slash explained. netsuite.com slash explained.
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
One thing that we've learned, many of us have learned over the last 18 months or so, is that there are different definitions of anti-Semitism. How do you and the Diaspora Alliance define it?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
Okay, so you kind of nailed it there, the really important thing. There's a spectrum of beliefs even within the Jewish community about how questioning Israel relates to anti-Semitism. Where do you personally fall on this spectrum?
Today, Explained
Project 2025’s next chapter
All right, let's get into the topic at hand, which is Project Esther. Do you remember when you first heard about Project Esther? Yes.