Otmar Szafnauer

And every time you went in there, there was a cup of tea, there was a hug, there was warmth from that team.

And that was created by Otmar.

And he then went on to work for Alpine and for Aston Martin.

He's done some of the biggest deals in the sport.

I mean, this is a guy, Damien, who when his team was struggling financially,

He paid the wages of the staff for two consecutive months and that ran into the millions.

And he was never sure whether that money would even come back to him.

That's the kind of guy he is.

So I always wanted to do a Formula One podcast, but it had to be done with the right people, with nice people, with genuine people, with interesting people.

And Rob and Otmar are those two people.

And of course they're brilliant friends.

A bit like you and I are on high performance.

Like you have to get on with each other and they're great mates.

And I think that makes a difference.

Well, there's no show that has an engineer and a team principal on it.

There's lots of podcasts with drivers and ex-drivers and lots of podcasts with journalists, but no podcasts with people who have actually sat there on the pit wall giving instructions as Rob Smedley did to Felipe Massa to pull over, to let a teammate through.

There aren't people who've had to

to sit at the very forefront of those big, big deals in Formula One, like Otmar has.

Otmar's a guy who's hired a lot of people.

He's also a guy who's lost his job.